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Super Concentration - Page 3
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Thread: Super Concentration

  1. #21
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    I enjoyed the story of 4 shipwrecked men and a banker on an island, but as long as man feels he must have government "leaders" I advise holding gold and silver in your possession. At least then they can't steal by going to some warehouse or by tapping a few keys on the keyboard to create inflation.
    Well, theoretically they can't steal by tapping a few keys on the keyboard, but on the other hand, I consider the manipulation of the silver and gold market a very underhanded form of theivery.

    Personally, I am getting real sick and tired of silver charts that look like the one we saw today.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kelly View Post
    Well, theoretically they can't steal by tapping a few keys on the keyboard, but on the other hand, I consider the manipulation of the silver and gold market a very underhanded form of theivery.

    Personally, I am getting real sick and tired of silver charts that look like the one we saw today.
    Maybe you misunderstood my meaning. When I mentioned stealing by tapping a few keys, I was referring to their ability to create FRN and thereby reduce the value of your FRN based money...some call it hidden taxation, which it is, but it is also theft. Maybe I should have mentioned the printing press for better understanding.

    Don't worry about silver or gold...bulls are known for being hard to ride...just hold on and you will be rewarded with the protection of your purchasing power. If you are trading, I wish you well, but have no advise.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by FedFixNix View Post
    I've seen just about every documentary Ron Paul ever made, or video interview with him. I've also read and reread Jekyll Island, by Griffin.

    The video is mis-titled, and although, like all Austrian viewpoints, it is seriously flawed on the solution side of the presentation. It should be "Usury Empire" Fiat is not the problem. Debt-based money is the problem. An unstable monetary system is the problem. Cycles of inflation and deflation are the problem.

    I haven't seen more than a few people on this board who even know what "fiat" is. At least they don't use the term accurately.

    Few people here have an accurate and clear concept of "money" as opposed to "wealth".

    Also, like most people here you have bought into the myth that government is the problem, and that private bankers can issue and regulate money better than government. The truth is that the private bankers have usurped and corrupted the government our founding fathers gave us.

    Government has never been the problem. BAD government is the problem.

    Government that is not of, by and for the people is the problem. Our constitution gave government the right to issue and control money, and the bankers bought that right away from the people's government, and thereby gained control over our nation's government.

    "Whoever issues and controls a nation's money control that nation." Steve Zarlenga, paraphrasing Meyer Amschel Rothschild.

    We, the people, need to take back our government and return it's power to issue interest-free money to the people's government". Then we could eliminate nearly all income taxes... immediately. The failure to do this very soon is going to result in the closing of the window to do so. It may not reopen for a long long time.

    It won't take more than a few years for you to realize that I'm hardly just "dreaming".

    "If the American people ever allow the banks to control the issuance of their currency, first by inflation, and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all property, until their children wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power of money should be taken from banks and restored to Congress and the people to whom it belongs. I sincerely believe the banking institutions having the issuing power of money, are more dangerous to liberty than standing armies." ~ Thomas Jefferson

    Here is some real truth about money reform:


    http://www.perfecteconomy.com/pg-why...only-fail.html


    Fiat money, irredeemable paper currency, not resting on a specie basis, but deriving its purchasing power from the declaratory fiat of the government issuing it. Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary, © 1996, 1998 MICRA, Inc.

    Fiat money primarily has value because it must be used for payment of taxes...ours must also be accepted for payment of debt...which raises the issue of paying debt with debt. I do not accept your definition of our money system as debt-based vs. fiat...I've heard that before and it just does not make sense to me. Sure it is debt-based, but it is also fiat.

    To claim that fiat is not the problem, as you do, implies an agenda or inability to see the facts. You imply that our money has value because it is based on debt...really? Since debt is anti-value, that does not compute. On which side of the balance sheet would you place "debt-based" money that is not also fiat?

    I agree, bad government is the problem...we have bad government...until we correct the problems with government, we need and I will use private money whenever and wherever someone agrees to accept it...not private bankers money as you wrongfully accused me of proposing.

    If we take back the government and allow them to issue fiat money, we will not have solved anything...maybe we will have delayed the total crash that is the natural ending for all fiat money, but it will still die and many of us will die with it.

    I did not say you were dreaming, but will say it now if you believe fiat will work as long as government is in control of the issuance...did you not learn anything from "The Creature???"

    I like that quote of Jefferson...even though scholars say he never said it and the words do not really fit his times, it makes good points. Anyway, here is where we are headed with our debt-based fiat money system:
    http://www.gold-eagle.com/gold_diges...lor041708.html

  4. #24
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    Default They are paying commercials to lease silver

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelly View Post
    Well, theoretically they can't steal by tapping a few keys on the keyboard, but on the other hand, I consider the manipulation of the silver and gold market a very underhanded form of theivery.

    Personally, I am getting real sick and tired of silver charts that look like the one we saw today.
    Me too, but today's tops them all! Check this out.

    http://www.kitco.com/lease.chart.silv.html

    The charts tell the story. The thieves now don't even try to cover their tracks or hide their actions. It's so obvious what they are doing!

  5. #25
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    Mike, I appreciate your position. It is one of some truth, but not the whole truth. It is the Austrian position, and I know it well... thoroughly. I've studied monetary theory extensively, along with macroeconomics, history, philosophy, sociology and political science and other related fields.

    If you want to find where your thinking, and that of the Austrians, has gone wrong about the gold standard, all you need do is read some of the books I've repeatedly suggested. Or watch the videos very carefully. The bottom line is that a retun to a gold standard would only complete the cycle of enrichment the Money-Changers set out to do the three times they have fully taken control of the US Money Supply. That cycle is one of boom and bust, repeated gold acquisitions and selloffs, depending on the gold and money monopolists manipulations and control of prices and physical bullion.

    The so-called gold standard for paper or electronic money is a cruel hoax, an illusion, a way for the Money & Gold Monopolists to control nations and ultimately the entire civilized (or not so civil) world.

    You need to find out why and how what I am saying here is true, and it is. I have no agenda but the truth. I own gold and silver, stocks and physical, but they will have increasing value in a collapsing economy no matter what kind of "funny money" or RFID chip becomes the monetary standard.

    My "agenda" is to try to save humanity from itself, and its ignorance, and its susceptibility to exploitation and manipulation.

    I don
    t want my children and grandchildren to suffer the future we are leaving them. I wouldn't want a criminal to suffer it.

    Our ignorance is selling us into slavery, and has been doing so for the past 225 years... longer for Europe and the UK.

    I am only one old man and I can only do so much. I need your help, and the help of anyone reading these posts.

    FFN

    "All of the perplexities, confusion, and distress in America arises, not from the defects of the Constitution or Confederation, not from want of honor or virtue, so much as from downright ignorance of the nature of coin, credit, and circulation." -- John Adams, Founding Father

    "History records that the money changers have used every form of abuse, intrigue, deceit, and violent means possible to maintain their control over governments by controlling money and its issuance." - President James Madison

    "You are a den of vipers and thieves and I intend to rout you out, and by the eternal God, I will rout you out. If Congress has the right to issue paper money, it was given them to be used by themselves, and not to be delegated to individuals or corporations.." -- Andrew Jackson's address to Congress 1829



    Quote Originally Posted by mikeck View Post
    Fiat money, irredeemable paper currency, not resting on a specie basis, but deriving its purchasing power from the declaratory fiat of the government issuing it. Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary, © 1996, 1998 MICRA, Inc.

    Fiat money primarily has value because it must be used for payment of taxes...ours must also be accepted for payment of debt...which raises the issue of paying debt with debt. I do not accept your definition of our money system as debt-based vs. fiat...I've heard that before and it just does not make sense to me. Sure it is debt-based, but it is also fiat.
    I never said our current money wasn't fiat, nor would I. So what are you arguing about?

    To claim that fiat is not the problem, as you do, implies an agenda or inability to see the facts.
    No, that is a very unfair and improper inference on your part, not an implication at all.

    You imply that our money has value because it is based on debt...really? Since debt is anti-value, that does not compute. On which side of the balance sheet would you place "debt-based" money that is not also fiat?
    Your entire argument above is specious, based on a total misunderstanding of my words. Why do you not quote me directly?

    I agree, bad government is the problem...we have bad government...until we correct the problems with government, we need and I will use private money whenever and wherever someone agrees to accept it...not private bankers money as you wrongfully accused me of proposing.
    I've "accused" you of nothing of the sort. But private bankers are the Fed and they control our money. Period.

    If we take back the government and allow them to issue fiat money, we will not have solved anything...maybe we will have delayed the total crash that is the natural ending for all fiat money, but it will still die and many of us will die with it.

    I did not say you were dreaming, but will say it now if you believe fiat will work as long as government is in control of the issuance...did you not learn anything from "The Creature???"

    I like that quote of Jefferson...even though scholars say he never said it and the words do not really fit his times, it makes good points. Anyway, here is where we are headed with our debt-based fiat money system:
    http://www.gold-eagle.com/gold_diges...lor041708.html
    Most of the above is addressed in my opening remarks here. The chart is absolutely correct, and shows the money collapse we are heading for a breakneck speed. The Austrians are correct in calling for change, they just have the wrong... no, make that the worst possible... solution.

    "In the Colonies, we issue our own paper money. It is called 'Colonial Scrip.' We issue it in proper proportion to make the goods and pass easily from the producers to the consumers. In this manner, creating ourselves our own paper money, we control its purchasing power and we have no interest to pay to no one. In this manner, by creating ourselves our own paper money, we control its purchasing power, and we have no interest to pay, to anyone.

    You see, a legitimate government can both spend and lend money into circulation, while banks can only lend significant amounts of their promissory bank notes, for they can neither give away nor spend but a tiny fraction of the money the people need. Thus, when your bankers here in England place money in circulation, there is always a debt principal to be returned and usury to be paid. The result is that you have always too little credit in circulation to give the workers full employment. You do not have too many workers, you have too little money in circulation, and that which circulates, all bears the endless burden of unpayable debt and usury." - *Benjamin Franklin Autobiography

  6. #26
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    I think FedFixNix is right about the gold. I've just been reading about…

    "The Secret Gold Treaty; the truth Behind WWII Gold, Nazi Plunder and the Elite Plans to Control our Financial Future…"

    http://www.deepblacklies.co.uk/goldtreaty_blurb.htm

    He's got several articles on his site talking about the gold plundered from WWII that I really never knew about before. It's very interesting stuff.

    http://www.deepblacklies.co.uk/the_spoils_of_war.htm

    http://www.deepblacklies.co.uk/hirohitos_gold.htm

    This guy is talking about 160 tons of WWII gold. At $1000 an ounce, that's $5,120,000,000. Gads... And it's all "black" gold, meaning that it's on nobody's books.
    Last edited by Kelly; 23rd April 2008 at 19:24.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kelly View Post
    I think FedFixNix is right about the gold. I've just been reading about…

    "The Secret Gold Treaty; the truth Behind WWII Gold, Nazi Plunder and the Elite Plans to Control our Financial Future…"

    http://www.deepblacklies.co.uk/goldtreaty_blurb.htm

    He's got several articles on his site talking about the gold plundered from WWII that I really never knew about before. It's very interesting stuff.

    http://www.deepblacklies.co.uk/the_spoils_of_war.htm

    http://www.deepblacklies.co.uk/hirohitos_gold.htm

    This guy is talking about 160 tons of WWII gold. At $1000 an ounce, that's $5,120,000,000. Gads... And it's all "black" gold, meaning that it's on nobody's books.

    Thanks for the links, Kelly. I am personally aware of much of what went on with the fascists after the war, and before. I hadn't seen some of these specifics though.

    But I reached my own conclusions about all this long ago. It's all just more evidence of massive fraud and corruption by the financiers and military industrial complex, or the "evil empire".

    "He who has the gold, rules"

    Isn't that the golden rule?

  8. #28
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    I, like you, do not believe a gold standard would solve our problems since that still leaves bad government in control of the money. I think we differ mostly on who/what can solve the problem. To me you seem to think government control of fiat is the solution...I think private competitive currency is the solution and that the winning currency will be backed by something of intrinsic value...then prices would return to their natural tendency to decline over time. Yes, it is constitutional...nowhere does the constitution give the government EXCLUSIVE power to provide our money. Privately minted money has some history in this country dating at least until the mid 1800's.

    It is true that government fiat money worked during colonial times, but I don't see many politicians now who care anywhere near as much about the future of this country as did at that time; therefore, I can't see how it could work...there are not many in office now who would pledge their life, fortune and sacred honor for our country.

    Quote Originally Posted by FedFixNix View Post
    I never said our current money wasn't fiat, nor would I. So what are you arguing about?

    No, that is a very unfair and improper inference on your part, not an implication at all.

    Your entire argument above is specious, based on a total misunderstanding of my words. Why do you not quote me directly?
    Then I misunderstood this: "The video is mis-titled, and although, like all Austrian viewpoints, it is seriously flawed on the solution side of the presentation. It should be "Usury Empire" Fiat is not the problem. Debt-based money is the problem. An unstable monetary system is the problem. Cycles of inflation and deflation are the problem."

    If so, guilty as charged...I'll guess I'll have to use questions until I better understand your style.

    I've "accused" you of nothing of the sort. But private bankers are the Fed and they control our money. Period.
    I guess I also misunderstood this: "Also, like most people here you have bought into the myth that government is the problem, and that private bankers can issue and regulate money better than government."

    The bankers are not truly private as pointed out in The Creature... I think truly private money would serve the people much better than government fiat...at least then there would be an obvious incentive to pay attention to what is valuable money and what is not.

    Let the government have their fiat and along side allow private value based money and as the saying goes, may the best man win.

  9. #29
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    Hi Mike, I commend your last post, and your efforts to sort out our nation's monetary problems. The biggest problem, I think, is that you are tending to oversimplify both my comments and the solutions that have been presented.

    What has to happen is for many people of good will need to educate themselves on the true sources of the problems and try to arrive at workable substitutes for what we have now.

    Here's what I think you are missing. I've written it here all over in the past couple of months, and also on the Kitco.com forum in the economics and politics sections.

    Private Monopoly Money and Resource Control by an elitist cabal of international bankers is the root, bottom-line cause of the money and economics problems of our entire world.

    Unrestrained, unchecked, unbalanced POWER is the problem! Power from ANY source, government, institutional, organizational, or individual. Unlimited power is always bad for a society as a whole.

    That monopoly power problem can be certainly be in conjunction with governments, especially bad governments... unrepresentative governments, and governments that are not committed to the welfare and interests of their population. But "government", per se, is not the problem! That has been the myth the bankers have needed us to believe for 225 years, in order to maintain their control ... their power...over us.

    If you, or anyone who is really looking for solutions, will read some of the references I've given here, We could have a basis for discussion. But there can be no basis for discussion without a clear understanding of the problem, and so far, I can count the people on one hand that I've found who can see it.

    A free-market can never exist in a monopoly-controlled environment. We don't have a free-market today, and we desperately need one. Neither do people generally comprehend what should be left to the markets, and why, and what should be the functions of governments at all levels, and why.

    Capitalism and its markets, like governments, can only work when they are as decentralized and as close to the people as practical or possible. The more centralized they become, the less accountable they are and the more arbitrary they become.

    Like Thomas Jefferson, I am the sworn enemy of ALL forms of tyranny and totalitarianism, no matter what disguise they are wearing.

    Right now we are discussing the tyranny of money and its power to corrupt even essentially good governments, as the USA's once was. I grieve that it is now only an empty shell of what it once was, and what our founding fathers tried so hard to give us.

    We will have to take up a few debatable specifics in your post at another time.

    Life beckons

    "Most Americans have no real understanding of the operation of the international money lenders... The accounts of the Federal Reserve System have never been audited. It operates outside the control of Congress and... manipulates the credit of the United States." -Sen. Barry Goldwater (R-AZ)

    FFN

    These two books are without equal if one truly wants to comprehend the great monetary issues of our time.

    The Lost Science of Money - Mythology & Power:

    Video: America: Freedom to Fascism :

    And these two videos:



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