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View Full Version : Worrisome Sign: APMEX out of almost everything!



akak
3rd December 2009, 02:08
I just decided to check APMEX's inventory of the four different precious metals, just for the heck of it, and was shocked to find that they are OUT of almost all the standard bullion coins, particularly the gold ones, which did not even occur last autumn during the lowest point of the PM price crash. Does that not strike anyone else as an ominous sign? One ounce Gold Eagles, Maple Leafs, Krugerrands, and Philharmonics: all out of stock. Silver Maple Leafs and Philharmonics: all out as well, with silver Eagles being listed as "extremely limited quantities."

I can believe the shortfall of silver bullion coins, but the shortage of gold bullion coins is unprecedented. Given the larger aboveground stocks of gold vs. silver, I find this a very troubling development.

beach miner
3rd December 2009, 03:17
Looks like Tulving is out of Gold, and Silver Eagles also. They do have about 1,900 1oz Gold Buffalo's from the U.S. Mint. It will be interesting to see how long they last. Seems like only a few nights ago they had both types of Eagles. I'm beginning to think the physical market is gonna be the hole that breaks the Silver Price Dam. Of the several things to cause it to rise in price--the falling Dollar, JPM Short, or lack of physical silver---I would like to see lack of Physical Silver be the reason. The other two can come back to bite us through manipulation, lack of physical silver will be a True Market Driver. Nice almost full moon night out there Akak--Main1 and the Asia market keep me up too. See Ya At The Top.

valerb
3rd December 2009, 03:35
I just decided to check APMEX's inventory of the four different precious metals, just for the heck of it, and was shocked to find that they are OUT of almost all the standard bullion coins, particularly the gold ones, which did not even occur last autumn during the lowest point of the PM price crash. Does that not strike anyone else as an ominous sign? One ounce Gold Eagles, Maple Leafs, Krugerrands, and Philharmonics: all out of stock. Silver Maple Leafs and Philharmonics: all out as well, with silver Eagles being listed as "extremely limited quantities."

I can believe the shortfall of silver bullion coins, but the shortage of gold bullion coins is unprecedented. Given the larger aboveground stocks of gold vs. silver, I find this a very troubling development.

I watch Tulving's site and there has been problems with Gold coins for several months, even Krugerrands. He has Krugerrands in stock now, along with a few other gold items, but 20 ounce minimums keeps the average Joe away. They have plenty of Silver, but the same problem with premium rounds. The one thing I noticed at Tulving's is he doesn't have any 1,000 ounce bricks to sell.

akak
3rd December 2009, 03:45
I watch Tulving's site and there has been problems with Gold coins for several months, even Krugerrands. He has Krugerrands in stock now, along with a few other gold items, but 20 ounce minimums keeps the average Joe away. They have plenty of Silver, but the same problem with premium rounds. The one thing I noticed at Tulving's is he doesn't have any 1,000 ounce bricks to sell.

That is quite unusual about the 1000 oz. silver bars, is it not?

I have checked Tulving's site off and on for over a year now, and always saw those 1000 oz. bars there every time I checked before. It seems very strange that those would sell out before other forms of silver, doesn't it? I mean, the market for them with the average investor has to be very limited, and yet they are supposedly by far the most common form of silver bullion in the world, in terms of total number of ounces. It seems, once again, very fishy.

beach miner
3rd December 2009, 03:54
Maybe they needed them to resupply what has been withdrawn from the Comex, JPM has to make good on some of their contracts--right, or can they just do cash. Glad to see your awake Valerb. I know your quite knowledgeable in this area. If ya got the time could you give me a JPM long and short Comex 101--along with elegible and reserve meaning of silver being held. Thanks.

TheLoneRanger
3rd December 2009, 05:03
As the retail silver gets all bought up the dealers are taking the 1000 oz bars to the mints to be melted down into 1 and 10 ozer's where the premiums are higher.

Silver rounds are common and acceptable as are generic silver bars in common sizes 1,5,10 oz...So long as you can actually take delivery of 1000 oz good delivery bars from the various metal exchanges.. you can make more common rounds and bars in silver. And as retail silver runs short premiums go up over and above whatever spot is doing.. cost of making a 1 oz round is usually under a dollar.. so there is an arbritage profit to be made melting down the 1000 ozers...

The fact that they can't make more 90% junk and that some folks actually melt down 90% to get .999 Fine will be driving the premiums up on 90% here shortly if the retail shortage gets much tighter... may drive the premiums higher than for 999 fine generics.. because they can always make more generics.

Check out the nucleo exchange.. already the buy back price on rounds and small bars is above spot... keep checking APMEX top 40 and watch the buy back price on the stuff they are out of go above spot and keeping going higher above spot as the retail shortage tightens and then falls again as the 1000er's sent out to be melted down for the smaller stuff start getting delivred back for sale as rounds and smal bars.

Gold is a little different .. but I don't know why.. folks want a little more pedigree on generic gold .. brand name matters more on gold.. people will buy no name 22 kt jewlery all day long... kmart special 50% off ( means that folks are only paying double spot price instead of 4x spot for mass produced hoop earings and chains ) no name 14 kt is okay .... but if I tried to come out with The Lonerangers Special 999 fine 1 oz gold rounds .. folks would probably not pay much of a premium.. but bullion they want brand names..

Silver .. no end of silver rounds with no mint names on it .. gold folks pay extra for assay cards on 1 gram bars.. go figure..

but yes.. this is how it starts.. premiums start ramping up common and popular retail PM's start getting hard to find.... ALLLLLL ABOARD...

silverheartbone
3rd December 2009, 05:32
I have 2009 some fine silver buffalo rounds that I am now willing to part with for $240 each.

I'll pay the shipping and insurance to destinations within the US.

ryshay
3rd December 2009, 05:54
Does that not strike anyone else as an ominous sign? One ounce Gold Eagles, Maple Leafs, Krugerrands, and Philharmonics: all out of stock. Silver Maple Leafs and Philharmonics: all out as well, with silver Eagles being listed as "extremely limited quantities."

Sweet. December is a great Comex delivery month and a great retail PM delivery month. What is it about Christmas that makes us want PMs?
I guess the retail PM market is confirming the steep run-up in the COMEX PM prices after all. I was worried about the paper gold parabolic gains lately, because they seemed unconfirmed by silver (higher GSR) and by PM miner stocks (lagging HUI). However, it seems that retail PM bullion demand is strong for silver & gold right now. Good news.

TheLoneRanger
3rd December 2009, 05:55
I have 2009 some fine silver buffalo rounds that I am now willing to part with for $240 each.

I'll pay the shipping and insurance to destinations within the US.

Just remember silver can't go as high as you might want to sell silver for if somebody isn't willing to buy silver for as high as you want to sell silver for.

valerb
3rd December 2009, 06:12
Maybe they needed them to resupply what has been withdrawn from the Comex, JPM has to make good on some of their contracts--right, or can they just do cash. Glad to see your awake Valera. I know your quite knowledgeable in this area. If ya got the time could you give me a JPN long and short Comex 101--along with eligible and reserve meaning of silver being held. Thanks.

Like everyone, I'm hanging on for a true Silver shortage. However, I do not believe we will ever see an actual melt down of COMEX. We may see the big shorts run through the wringer, but any settlements will in all likelihood be in cash. The commodities exchange is just too important to the world, to allow it to fail.

We all read about these huge numbers of contracts in both Gold and Silver and that some day it will have to be resolved. I don't see that happening, unless the government forces contract limits on the big players and even then, they are in all likelihood going to give them a way out. Most investors have no desire at all to actually take delivery of physical Silver. They are in it for the cash settlement, not actual Silver. Even when deliveries are taken, they almost never come out of the actual COMEX warehouses. For instance, there were 1,283 Silver contracts to be delivered by 12/2/2009 and hardly any movement from the COMEX warehouse inventories. That's 6,415,000 ounces of Silver that was delivered and we have no idea where it was delivered from or to. That is, we know it came out of the system, which would be any mint, wholesaler or whatever their status is, along with the COMEX REGISTERED or ELIGIBLE inventory, that is considered to be in the custody of COMEX deliverable 1,000 ounce bars and it may very well have ended up right back into the COMEX warehouse under a different owner. There may only be 20 million ounce or possibly 300 million ounces in that chain. It's information we'll never find out until there is a true shortage.

Why I say the COMEX will never melt down, is because there is actual Silver available to sell. It's not all paper and there are real players in this game. One just needs to understand what that inventory in the COMEX warehouse represents. First, there are two categories. The Registered category is the Silver available to purchase, but some of the sellers, if not most are just like you and I. They all have there own price point that they are willing to let their silver be purchased. It could be $19.50 an ounce or $35.00 an ounce. Then there are those that have Silver in the warehouse that is actually there to fulfill their short contract obligations if necessary. That's another one of those inside trade secrets that we'll never find out about. So there are two classes of investors in the Registered category. Those that actually purchased their contracts and have left their Silver in the COMEX system and have put it up for sale at a higher price and those that purchased their Silver and are using it to back their short contracts. Either of these two groups could have purchased their Silver outside of the COMEX system and had it delivered, assayed and added to the inventory.

The other COMEX category is called ELIGIBLE. It consists of the same two groups of investors, but is not available for sale at this time. One would think that the majority of this inventory would belong to long term investors, but you never know.

So while there will undoubtedly be fireworks with COMEX paper investors at some point in time, that will not cause a run on the physical inventory actually in the COMEX warehouse itself, unless the sell price points have been met. At some point in time, when the price rises enough, the investors with Silver in the Eligible category will also move their Silver into the REGISTERED category.

There are two things I know for sure, there will always be someone in the REGISTERED category with a sell point higher than anyone is willing to pay and there will always be someone in the ELIGIBLE category that won't sell their Silver no matter how high the price rises.

Keep in mind that no matter how much someone pays for their Silver contract, it doesn't indicate they will actually take possession. They may very well move it into the ELIGIBLE category or leave it in the REGISTERED category to be sold at a higher price.

There is a great deal more involving the COMEX system, but this is a condensed version.

valerb
3rd December 2009, 07:09
As the retail silver gets all bought up the dealers are taking the 1000 oz bars to the mints to be melted down into 1 and 10 ozer's where the premiums are higher.



I really don't think that is the case as most of the mints are running all out using Silver in the chain before it is ever cast into 1,000 ounce bars.

Keep in mind that there are different forms of so called mints. Some are just stamping plants, like the US Mint and they rely on full functioning mints that can process Silver into blanks for them to stamp. The dealers have to rely on these full functioning mints to make products for them with their names or however they want them manufactured.

Last years so called retail shortage was a double hit for the dealers. The biggest hit came from JM, when they stopped producing 100 ounce bars and the mints drastically reduced products for them to sell as the mints were selling everything they could manufacture themselves. The stamping plants were also in trouble as the mints were not providing them with the blanks.

Dealers starting selling poor quality products from small mints no one ever heard of before, 1,000 ounce bars and a few even sold Silver shot. Basically anything they could get their hands on. While the full functioning mints were rolling in profits like they've never seen before. I know NWTM quadrupled production, doubled their premiums and discontinued wholesale business with the dealers for several months. Talk about rolling in the FRNs. Academy became a fan favorite and even Ohio Precious Metals was selling all they could produce. Yes, their still in business, but who sells their products anymore?

main1event
3rd December 2009, 07:13
I think it really sucks for dealers. Thats one reason I know we are no where near a bubble in PMs. Just like Real Estate agents were making a killing during the housing boom, dealers will make a killing when PMs are in a bubble.

beach miner
3rd December 2009, 07:20
Thanks alot Val: That is as good as it gets for Comex 101. Thanks for taking the time teach me. Fortunately I got an A in PM's -Staked out gold mining claims, and bought as much silver as possible for the last 10 years. Never learned the Wall Street stuff. Really didn't have to. Had the basics down. It blows my mind how complex the Banksters have made it. If I can help ya find gold in the ground where you live, let me know, I'll gladly tell ya what I can. See Ya At The Top.

podrag
3rd December 2009, 08:15
More brilliance from the keyboard of the Lone Ranger. Cash to make purchases is a finite amount. Especially when there is the pay-lag factored in, and it is all based on "trust" (at some point) and a default by one higher up knocks over everyone down-line in the faith-in-being-paid sector. A year ago I let an upline use $100,000 of my inheritance $$ free to tide him over during the worst of it, 'cause he's always supplied us with 'stuff' when PITA dealers were turned away emptyhanded.

It takes unbelievable wads of cash for even the small tater dealers like us. Peeps prefer cash. At shows I have seen dealers who were offered something wave it away as if it were a tenacious fly, acting indifference and no interest, which caused looks of amazement on sellers' faces, who thought they had a sure-thing item with which to rustle up some cash.

Donkeys will FLY before those Boyz Admit the Truth, "Sorry, Bucko. I'm out of money." Deep down they WANT it, just cannot AFFORD it. We're gonna see more of that. Face saving instead of spitting out the honest-to-God truth about financial funding at the moment. Prepare yourselves for that outcome....

I also see the day coming when bullion dealing is gonna be like running a Casino is already. Your PM "Winnings" IMO are one day at risk for it becoming mandatory that whoever you sell to is gonna have to withhold a govt "cut" that you'll never see, no longer content to wait 'til you file your taxes by April 15, just as the Casinos in Las Vegas must do over lucky winners. We already hafta post that legal **** on the wall from the govt about cash transactions. Y'know the one - applies to "terrorists" like those who like PMs, LOL.

I can readily see the day coming when small dealers will hang up the "closed sign" permanently, but if rent is affordable enough, as ours is, to keep it open for a Guy Hangout anyway for peeps of like mind, interest, and who've become extended family to meet, because rules and regs and cost of doing bid'ness can take any fun out of it.

Well that's the time you fly to Dubai with your PMs and sell them there. The world is bigger than Jimmy Jim Bob's bullion store in Birmingham Alabama.

The price you sell your PMs for is limited by your imagination as much by the market at that point. Only idiots will pay a PM windfall tax or sell their bullion for less than the going rate.

Smuggle it to the middle east and sell it there.

valerb
3rd December 2009, 08:39
Your PM "Winnings" IMO are one day at risk for it becoming mandatory that whoever you sell to is gonna have to withhold a govt "cut" that you'll never see, no longer content to wait 'til you file your taxes by April 15, just as the Casinos in Las Vegas must do over lucky winners.

That will be better than the old local sales tax we had to pay on PM back in the 90's. Well, not percentage wise. I walked in and bought 30 ounces of Gold for $8 over spot per ounce. Gold was around $280 plus about $20 in sales tax per ounce and then the premium. I gave him the cash and he gave me the gold and no paperwork. Something told me I just gave him an extra $600 in premium. Then again, there was no trail that I ever bought any gold either.

You know if the IRS ever goes to that next step, filling out a form won't be good enough. They'll want photo copies of the social security card and our drivers license and probably an actual photo of us. Of course the photo's will have to be done with a government only approved camera, which will sell for $2,500 and not be any better than an old paxiflash.

valerb
3rd December 2009, 09:08
Smuggle it to the middle east and sell it there.

Let's see, the cost of a round trip ticket to the middle east and the airlines excessive baggage weight for all that Silver just ate up all your savings. To top it off, the employees screening your luggage spotted the Silver and reported it to the FEDS. So on your return flight home, customs arrested you for smuggling PM's out of the country and confiscates all of your ill gotten gains. To top it off, they also confiscate your car for transporting the Silver to the airport. Then you have to borrow money to pay for your bail and a taxi ride home, because you no longer own a vehicle. Now you need a lawyer because your facing charges for smuggling and income tax evasion. You have no chance of winning and they are going to make an example out of you with a maximum sentence and a 350 pound cell mate named Bubba, who can't wait for some of that special kind of lov'in that only you can provide.

I think I'm going to track Sue-S-Q down, fill out the four page IRS document, let her copy my S.S. card, drivers license and take my picture. I'll get to keep my freedom, my car, my cut from the profits and most of all my choice of sexual partners.

podrag
3rd December 2009, 09:14
Let's see, the cost of a round trip ticket to the middle east and the airlines excessive baggage weight for all that Silver just ate up all your savings. To top it off, the employees screening your luggage spotted the Silver and reported it to the FEDS. So on your return flight home, customs arrested you for smuggling PM's out of the country and confiscates all of your ill gotten gains. To top it off, they also confiscate your car for transporting the Silver to the airport. Then you have to borrow money to pay for your bail and a taxi ride home, because you no longer own a vehicle. Now you need a lawyer because your facing charges for smuggling and income tax evasion. You have no chance of winning and they are going to make an example out of you with a maximum sentence and a 350 pound cell mate named Bubba, who can't wait for some of that special kind of lov'in that only you can provide.

I think I'm going to track Sue-S-Q down, fill out the four page IRS document, let her copy my S.S. card, drivers license and take my picture. I'll get to keep my freedom, my car, my cut from the profits and most of all my choice of sexual partners.

That's if you get caught. If you pay the taxes you're a bitch anyway.

valerb
3rd December 2009, 09:25
That's if you get caught. If you pay the taxes you're a bitch anyway.

Yes, but I'll be my wifes bitch, not Bubba's.

podrag
3rd December 2009, 10:00
Yes, but I'll be my wifes bitch, not Bubba's.

I was thinking more the state's bitch. After all the evil they commit you're still happy to hand over your hard-earned without a fight.

Investing in PMs is about keeping their hands off your purchasing power.

It's a bitch move if you ask me... going to all that effort just to give up at the end.

Losers pay taxes, winners avoid them.

valerb
3rd December 2009, 10:31
Trust me, Val, darlin', we will be TF OUT of it before THAT ever happens. Although I do see that kinda ham-handed **** on the horizon.

Pictures? We ain't gonna take no stinkin' pictures. Don't want your SS number either, nor driver's license. We may deal with a person for a year or more before even learning their last NAME. And if it comes to wanting to address as something other than "hey you!" I may say, "What's your first name?" (i.e. like in a 12 Step Meeting - and NO I am NOT a drunk!!! reformed or otherwise). And when newby people get friendly and decide it's a neat place to hang around and someone new perches on a stool I WILL introduce them BY FIRST NAME ONLY and if they swap last names that is THEIR BIZ.

The way we do bookwork is excruciating,and we pay income tax out the wazoo (which we are aware many sellers DO NOT, but that's their biz, not ours) but often the headers of sales tickets are left blank except for the date/merchandise of the numbered tickets, which some like to have for record keeping of their own over the long haul. They go by number and after awhile we couldn't tell who bought what. And at our ages, we can always say, "SENILITY, idiots" to those who would pillory. And use the USG ruse of "I can't remember" if called in question. LOL. If someone (usually new) sees someone come in and make a serious buy and they ask, "Who is that?" we say, "We have no idea..." and from the silence and long looks those others gathered around give them, they don't make that nosey faux pas again.

Over on *** we had a dude going to Africa on a mission trip, wondered about taking along PMs on the flight over in case TSHTF while he was abroad, he asked everyones' opinions, and pretty much it was construed that if he hopped a flight with that stuff he might well get tripped up in customs somewhere along the line and have his property confiscated by one nation or t'other. Since he was going out to do mission work on the Dark Continent the general consensus was that he "trust God" to take care of his fanny and leave his stack at home. Where he now safely is. Again.

My local shop runs his business just about the same way. He just doesn't get to pocket any local income tax anymore. When I first wanted to buy gold from him, I told him I wanted $10,000 worth and he said no. He explained the $10,000 IRS rule as he understood it and said he would sell me 30 ounces. If I wanted to go somewhere else and buy another 30 ounces, that was up to me. Was he being honest and helpful or was he making sure I stayed under the $10,000 limit so there was no paperwork and he was free to keep the local sales tax? I guess it was a potential win/win situation. Fortunately they dropped the local sales tax on PM and that was the only time I ever had the extra taxes. The guy does move one hell of a lot of 100 ounce Silver bars and only sells premium rounds, with the exception of what he buys off of his customers. I buy from him, but I would never sell anything to him. He has the best prices when you want to buy, but not when it comes time to sell. The best prices are with a local guy that only buys and never sells, at least not to the public. You meet in a public restraunt, it's safe and it's all cash and carry. I don't know what his deal is, but he is listed in the yellow pages and only lists a phone number.

TheLoneRanger
3rd December 2009, 11:06
I had one of my Buddy's crank this up for me , and I forgot about it.. it was back a couple weeks ago when we were talking taxes

408 (m) Investment in collectibles treated as distributions

(1) In general
The acquisition by an individual retirement account or by an individually-directed account under a plan described in section 401(a) of any collectible shall be treated (for purposes of this section and section 402) as a distribution from such account in an amount equal to the cost to such account of such collectible.

(2) Collectible defined
For purposes of this subsection, the term “collectible” means—
(A) any work of art,
(B) any rug or antique,
(C) any metal or gem,
(D) any stamp or coin,
(E) any alcoholic beverage, or
(F) any other tangible personal property specified by the Secretary for purposes of this subsection.


(3) Exception for certain coins and bullion
For purposes of this subsection, the term “collectible” shall not include—
(A) any coin which is—
(i) a gold coin described in paragraph (7), (8), (9), or (10) of section 5112 (a) of title 31, United States Code,
(ii) a silver coin described in section 5112 (e) of title 31, United States Code,
(iii) a platinum coin described in section 5112 (k) of title 31, United States Code, or
(iv) a coin issued under the laws of any State, or

(B) any gold, silver, platinum, or palladium bullion of a fineness equal to or exceeding the minimum fineness that a contract market (as described in section 7 of the Commodity Exchange Act, 7 U.S.C. 7) [2] requires for metals which may be delivered in satisfaction of a regulated futures contract,

if such bullion is in the physical possession of a trustee described under subsection (a) of this section.

5112 (e)
(e) Notwithstanding any other provision of law, the Secretary shall mint and issue, in quantities sufficient to meet public demand, coins which—
(1) are 40.6 millimeters in diameter and weigh 31.103 grams;
(2) contain .999 fine silver;
(3) have a design—
(A) symbolic of Liberty on the obverse side; and
(B) of an eagle on the reverse side;
(4) have inscriptions of the year of minting or issuance, and the words “Liberty”, “In God We Trust”, “United States of America”, “1 Oz. Fine Silver”, “E Pluribus Unum”, and “One Dollar”; and
(5) have reeded edges.

Well I said what the heck oes that mean... just what it says.. he says...

So hopefully he is going to write a whole paper on this in the next couple of months in english.. for free.. if I win a bet.. on Jan 1st.

I told him I didn't think he undertood the question.. and explained that I held silver outside of 401K and IRA and sometimes bought and sold small ammounts on a cash basis etc.. so how would the Tax guys even know... he said no problem , if you ever get audited they will see if your expendetures match your proveable income and if it does no problem , if it doesn't the taxman will ask you to explain the differnce and if you can't they will tax you by their estimate of your actual income and if things look hinky they will seriously dig into your " well he didn't say stuff" but I will say "stuff" and if they turn up any evidence od evasion in word or deed.. inculding Tax evasion but also false statements, they will cme down onyou like a ton of bricks with penalties , interest an possibly prosecution.. and then he addedn IF you get audited in the first place..

thats where I said I need the whole detailed breakdown In english.. and he said okay, and then we opened another beer and talked bowl games and new years etc..

So y'all Saddle Up and take your chances.. He also said due to the Patriot act all checks and CC transactions go thru DHS computers now and that the Credit card companies are going to , or already have, started sharing info with the IRS.

I'm thinking the first real good step to not getting audited is maybe not openly declaring you intend to try and evade taxes.. maybe

paper_no_more
3rd December 2009, 11:11
My usual dealer in the UK just reported totally out of ASE monster boxes, what few coins are left are nearly $27.85 USD each, with similar rises across the board.

Also totally out of the mixed rounds tubes, which were a real-life Forest Gump 'Box o' Chocolates' and I will miss them.

Ebay silver coin area is absolutely buzzing!!!!

TheLoneRanger
3rd December 2009, 12:03
Just as a thought.. as unlikely that you will ever get audited is.. if you ever were.. about that last thing you would want in your background is a public declaration that you intended to commit the crime... well thats true for any crime generlly speking.. but dude.. on taxes,, you are handing the man all he needs to make you his "Biatch".


but it gets worse.. something like .." You Honor as our application for a search warrant indicates the suspects computer may have been used to communicate his intent to co-conspirators of a like mind who may also be involved with a similar activity.. so we need to search his computer for a list of contacts and their statements for our investigation".

valerb
3rd December 2009, 12:29
I was thinking more the state's bitch. After all the evil they commit you're still happy to hand over your hard-earned without a fight.

Investing in PMs is about keeping their hands off your purchasing power.

It's a bitch move if you ask me... going to all that effort just to give up at the end.

Losers pay taxes, winners avoid them.

I don't know where you buy your PM or how much you have, but most of mine was purchased over the Internet with records and I'm not going to be able to sell it under the table even if I wanted to, unless I sell it in small lots. It's not like I'm one of the Hunt brothers, but I don't plan on selling any until Silver at least reaches $50 and then I will sell one to two thousand ounces. I really don't know how to dump that kind of Silver under the table, especially when your talking about $50,000 to $100,000 in one transaction. If the price keeps going up, I'll be selling it off 1,000 ounces at a time and the amount will be greater and greater on each sale. Even if I could find someone, I'd be scared to death they might be an undercover IRS agent or I'd get ripped off. Whenever Silver hits these high numbers, I can see a black market springing up, but they will also be looking to buy at a substantial discount. If I only owned a few hundred ounces that I bought locally, I might be tempted to try and sell it off in small lots. I just don't know what the on-line dealers did with the purchase information and I'm not willing to find out the hard way. I think I have a problem, what about the really large investors that have to store their Silver at a bullion vault, there is no hiding that information. I seriously doubt you'll find many investors hiding 20,000 ounces or more in their basements. Even 5,000 ounces is worth $95,000 today and you better have one hell of a hiding place. At the much talked about $100 figure, your now hiding a half million dollars in your house and then trying to sell it under the table.

Yes, I'm going to be a bitch to the state, as are many other stacker's on this site. Many others won't and some "will" end up behind bars.

I think it is also a state of mind and what your already paying in taxes. I'm on S.S. and get the first 15% tax free, but the last 85% is taxed at 28%, because my wife is still working. To me, capital gains tax would be like our regular income tax. To someone in a much lower tax bracket, it would be a much harder pill to swallow.

I don't know how you consider someone a loser if they pay taxes on being a winner. I don't like being in the 28% tax bracket either, but I wouldn't be as happy in life if I were in the 10% bracket, that's for sure. Actually, I'd be much happier if we were in the 33% tax bracket.

What is Truth?
3rd December 2009, 14:19
If the big online dealers are getting low on inventory then perhaps it is due to not only increased sales but also limited supply coming in. Many sellers may be selling at their local dealers rather than shipping it across country and waiting for their check to arrive. That may be true even if if they bought from places like APMEX.

What I would like to know is how well stocked are your local dealers now?

podrag
3rd December 2009, 14:24
Just as a thought.. as unlikely that you will ever get audited is.. if you ever were.. about that last thing you would want in your background is a public declaration that you intended to commit the crime... well thats true for any crime generlly speking.. but dude.. on taxes,, you are handing the man all he needs to make you his "Biatch".


but it gets worse.. something like .." You Honor as our application for a search warrant indicates the suspects computer may have been used to communicate his intent to co-conspirators of a like mind who may also be involved with a similar activity.. so we need to search his computer for a list of contacts and their statements for our investigation".

I don't think anyone should pay their taxes. Taxes are for peasants. Period. Hear that Inland Revenue? **** you.

Ardent Listener
3rd December 2009, 15:10
If the big online dealers are getting low on inventory then perhaps it is due to not only increased sales but also limited supply coming in. Many sellers may be selling at their local dealers rather than shipping it across country and waiting for their check to arrive. That may be true even if if they bought from places like APMEX.

What I would like to know is how well stocked are your local dealers now?

Can anyone tell us how well is APMEX paying for precious metals at this time? That could be one reason for low inventory. But it may not be the reason of course.

TheLoneRanger
3rd December 2009, 15:14
Can anyone tell us how well is APMEX paying for precious metals at this time? That could be one reason for low inventory. But it may not be the reason of course.

Ardent their buy prices are listed in their site.. just click on the 'Top 40" icon to see what they are out of and what they are paying.. last I checked they are out of about half the top 40 and paying above spot in most of those catergories ..

Another good check is at the nucleo lot of small silver stuff is above spot as well.

TheLoneRanger
3rd December 2009, 15:57
I don't think anyone should pay their taxes. Taxes are for peasants. Period. Hear that Inland Revenue? **** you.


My my my you have one of the worst cases of liberal victim "the world owes me a living" entitlement attitudes I have seen in a while... what happened darling? your goverment provided unicorn quit pooping skittles for you? poor baby, somebody needs a hug..

valerb
3rd December 2009, 16:24
Can anyone tell us how well is APMEX paying for precious metals at this time? That could be one reason for low inventory. But it may not be the reason of course.

I think the lack of premium rounds has forced people to purchase the generics and there really isn't enough coming out of the pipeline to handle that load. NWTM and others cut off the dealers when things got tight last year, don't be surprised if it doesn't happen again. Tulving seems to have plenty of inventory, but they don't sell small quantities, so that might be why APMEX is running out sooner. With the ASE out of production, maybe Sunshine will sell more blanks to some of the stamping plants. Then again, they may be obligated to keep all of their production for the 2010 run.

valerb
3rd December 2009, 16:41
what happened darling?

That caught me off guard and I had to take a close look at your picture. I never realized you were a female.

Reminds me of last year when someone wrote they were in love, after something I wrote about silver and a friend promptly posted a message telling him, he was barking up the wrong tree that she was actually a he!
Whoops!

TheLoneRanger
3rd December 2009, 16:54
Who is that masked woman?

I don't know , but she left this... holds up a silver bullet...
fade to theme music

slvr
3rd December 2009, 17:14
I just looked and APMEX has 1600 + Gold Eagles available and 9999 (at least) SAE's. Am I missing something? I did notice the premium jumped big time on the GAE's

PSUDave
3rd December 2009, 19:14
I just looked and APMEX has 1600 + Gold Eagles available and 9999 (at least) SAE's. Am I missing something? I did notice the premium jumped big time on the GAE's

I'm seeing plenty of material in stock also. Don't know what the op is looking at.

akak
3rd December 2009, 19:19
I'm seeing plenty of material in stock also. Don't know what the op is looking at.

I guess the situation changed since yesterday, but it WAS as stated 24 hours ago.

What is Truth?
3rd December 2009, 19:30
I guess the situation changed since yesterday, but it WAS as stated 24 hours ago.


I sold so they should be set for a while.

DaleFromCalgary
4th December 2009, 09:37
Yesterday (Dec 4) I went into my local dealer but they only had four 10-ounce bars of silver, still no palladium, and I didn't even bother to ask the price of gold. The bars were no-name ingots plus a couple of Johnson-Matthey. Price for silver was C$23.08, up from last week.