View Full Version : Yet another reason to favor silver over gold

12th November 2009, 15:19

This article talks about a Chinese company, Chinatungsten (http://www.tungsten-alloy.com/en/alloy11.htm) that ADVERTISES on its website that it can make tungsten filled gold coins.

Tungsten is much cheaper than gold, but has a very similar density to gold, so gold-covered tungsten bars would be very difficult to identify as "fake gold".

Chinatungsten says ON THEIR WEBSITE:

"Why tungsten alloy is used as gold substitution?
In theory, as its density is 19.1g/cm3, which is approximately 70% denser than lead, uranium could be used as material of making fake coin. However, it is weakly radioactive and not as dense as gold, so it does not appear to be a practical method.

Then people have discovered that tungsten is environmental-friendly, durable and hardness, the most important is that its density of 19.25g/cm3 is just about the same density as gold (19.3g/cm3), which bears the similar specific gravity. These advantages make tungsten enjoys the superiority to be the best substitute for the costly metal of gold or platinum. It is necessary to tell that alloying gold with tungsten would not work for several reasons but a coin with a tungsten center and gold all around it could not be detected as counterfeit by density measurement alone."


Good thing there is no fake silver as of yet...

12th November 2009, 15:23
The give away would be that like iron and nickel, tungsten will react to a magnet, so it would be difficult to pass off to anyone with even a little knowledge.

12th November 2009, 15:33
No it won't react to a magnet.

But if you have some sophisticated eqiupment, you should be able to somehow test for tungsten's paramagnetic properties.


"Gold is diamagnetic, tungsten paramagnetic. That difference could be used to detect tungsten too; but a simple magnet does NOT detect tungsten"

Diamagnetism appears in all materials, and is the tendency of a material to oppose an applied magnetic field, and therefore, to be repelled by a magnetic field. However, in a material with paramagnetic properties (that is, with a tendency to enhance an external magnetic field), the paramagnetic behavior dominates http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetism

What is paramagnetic?


12th November 2009, 15:43
If fakes every became widespread, then people would just start splitting coins and bars in half to make sure they are not filled. It does make you wonder though how many gold fakes are their.

12th November 2009, 15:44
I wonder also how hard the Treasury would/will enforce counterfitting laws.
Say you received one of these in the form of an American Eagle with a $50 denomanation and you called the ATF to investigate.
I know they will spend a million to find a guy printing out 20's in his garage.
How hard will they go after forged coins.
If there is some teeth there it might make dealing in only American Eagles worth the extra premium.
Canadian Maple Leafs might fall in the same bracket.
Maybe the legal tender laws regarding circulating currency will actual give you some added protection.

12th November 2009, 15:48
Thanks! I apologize for the mis-information. I forgot where I had read about paramagnetism, but that really doesn't matter, as I obviously mis-understood it anyhow.

12th November 2009, 22:06
You've got to own BOTH gold and silver. Not just one or the other.

12th November 2009, 22:38
No it won't react to a magnet.


What is paramagnetic?


somethin glike ferrus and noferus--- ANY HOOOOO, WHERE CAN IT GET OME TUNSTANG AND A GALLON OF GOLD PAINT???

save big --gold just $750 an oz \\Paramagnetism is a form of magnetism which occurs only in the presence of an externally applied magnetic field. Paramagnetic materials are attracted to magnetic fields, hence have a relative magnetic permeability of ≥1 (1 or more, a positive magnetic susceptibility). The magnetic moment induced by the applied field is linear in the field strength and rather weak. It typically requires a sensitive analytical balance to detect the effect and modern measurements on paramagnetic materials are often conducted with a SQUID magnetometer. Unlike ferromagnets, paramagnets do not retain any magnetization in the absence of an externally applied magnetic field, because thermal motion causes the spins to become randomly oriented without it.[[ SHORTAGE OF VALIENCE ELETRONS }} Thus the total magnetization will drop to zero when the applied field is removed. Even in the presence of the field there is only a small induced magnetization because only a small fraction of the spins will be oriented by the field. This fraction is proportional to the field strength and this explains the linear dependency. The attraction experienced by ferromagnets is non-linear and much stronger, so that it is easily observed, for instance, in magnets on one's refrigerator

12th November 2009, 22:57
While physical gold will protect our wealth, it’s the gold stocks that can potentially make us wealthy.

Once again, to get a sense of the Lilliputian size of the gold industry, I compared it to several other leading industries and stocks.

The value, as measured by market capitalization, of all gold producers around the world is less than Walmart’s. Every gold stock would need to nearly double just for the industry to match ExxonMobil. The oil and gas industry is about 12 times bigger.

When your neighbors and relatives and co-workers and friends all start clamoring to buy gold stocks, the pressure on prices will be enormous, rocketing our positions upwards.

Meanwhile – and admitting we’re first and foremost gold bugs – the picture for silver is even more dramatic. The potential for silver stocks is jaw-dropping.

If the gold industry is tiny, then silver’s $9 billion market cap makes it a nano industry. The entire silver industry is over 21 times smaller than gold’s! If gold explodes, silver will go supernova.

Consider these macro-facts about a micro-market and what they reveal about silver’s enormous potential:

* There are over 200 companies in the S&P 500 with a market cap larger than the entire market of silver producers
* There are five times more gold stocks than silver.
* Total silver production in 2008 was valued around $10.3 billion (at today’s prices). That represents just 1.5% of the $700 billion bailout last year, and 0.006% of the current U.S. monetary base.
* Of the 20 largest silver producers, only five actually call themselves a “silver” company, due to the fact that about 73% of all silver mined is a byproduct of other metals mining.

Any flood into the silver market would overwhelm it. In other words, the rise will be stunning. While it’s not going to happen tomorrow, I strongly suggest you get on board before that rocket ship takes off.

Just putting these charts together stirred my feelings of restlessness, making me anxious for the mania in precious metals to arrive. But the timing is not up to us. Be patient, because if you’re invested in gold and silver and the respective, high-quality stocks, you’re on the right side of this trend.

13th November 2009, 04:14
You've got to own BOTH gold and silver. Not just one or the other.

Not with a 64/1 ratio.