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FedFixNix
21st September 2008, 21:15
Would you really like to understand the current financial meltdown and coming world depression? Would you like to become part of the solution rather than remain a part of the problem? If so, you must educate yourself, and this is no easy task amidst such an imposing sea of confusion, misinformation, and deliberate disinformation and deceptions. Lies and special interests are everywhere, but you must dig deep for the truth that will set you, and all of us, free from the economic bondage in store for us and our descendants.

My main suggestion would be to obtain the book, Web of Debt, by Ellen Brown. She has done more to "demystify" the subject of money more than anyone else I have read. Stephen Zarlenga's The Lost Science of Money had been my favorite until I recently finished Web of Debt. Both books have excellent road maps to get out of the disaster we have scripted for our nation, and the world. The important thing is to begin the needed discussions and debates. For further education and information on what you are not being told by mainstream media or official sources, I ask you to read these books or watch the online videos. The first two videos are very educational, and highly recommended for basic starting information:

Simplest Video = Money as Debt (47 min) - watch it free here: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-9050474362583451279

Comprehensive Video = MoneyMasters (3.5 hrs) - watch it free here: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-515319560256183936

Watch the above, preferably in that order, as Money as Debt is simpler and a better introduction to the root problem with our money and banking system. The Money Masters is more comprehensive, longer (3.5 hours and 2 disks). These videos will very accurately indentify the root causes of our financial meldown and the coming Greatest Depression. You may have to watch them several times before the big picture really sinks in.

Another outstanding free online series of short video presentations is by Chris Martenson: www.chrismartenson.com/crashcourse This series is one of the finest I've yet seen, and jam packed with good and reliable info. I suggest watching lessons 6, 7 and 8 (each about 6 to 8 minutes) of this outstanding presentation by one of the brightest teachers I've ever heard on the subject. Chris Martenson: http://www.chrismartenson.com/crashcourse The series of video lessons is not yet finished, but if you watch 6,7 and 8 on money, you will want to watch the entire series over time, and explore the gold mine of references on the coming financial tsunami. You need to prepare for the events ahead. Your faith will be tested.

This website has a cornucopia of great articles and presentations on the widest range of monetary and finance topics. Highly recommended: http://www.chrismartenson.com/EssentialArticles

For real comprehension of our monetary and economic problems, and how to get out of the money trap we are now caught up in, you will need to obtain the best books written on thise subjects, and devote some time to study them. You simply cannot fully wrap your mind around the enormity of these issues without doing some serious homework. Trust me when I say that almost everyone who claims to have solutions to our problems, don't, and their "solutions" will in fact only make things far worse by playing right into the hands of those who have designed the grand chess game we are all playing. And we are all playing, like it or not.

For instance, a popular solution advanced by certain schoold of economics teach that the way out is a return to the gold or silver money standards. This is simply untrue, and the worst move that humanity could make. All I have time to do now is impress the reader that ALL major schools of economics are owned and controlled by the archetects of the NWO! The methods that will deliver us from our bondage have been systematically suppressed and ridiculed by the power brokers who are destroying our independence and liberty. In 99% of the cases what the economics experts will advise is wrong, because that is what they are paid to teach and to advise.

John Kenneth Galbraith, in a moment of candor, spoke truly: "The study of money, above all other fields in economics, is one in which complexity is used to disguise truth or to evade truth, not to reveal it (p15). The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled." - John Kenneth Galbraith, Money: Whence it came, where it went - 1975, p29.

With that in mind, here are the books I urge people to read:

Best Book (By Far) and most recent = Web of Debt: http://webofdebt.wordpress.com/feedback/ (Publisher's website reviews and comments) Author Ellen H. Brown's website packed with good info and the best articles I've yet found on up to date events: http://www.webofdebt.com

Amazon Reviews of Web of Debt are extremely useful to guage the opinions of others on any book one is considering. My own review of this book is among over 40 posted there: http://www.amazon.com/review/product/0979560810/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?%5Fencoding=UTF8&showViewpoints=1

Another Best Book = The Lost Science of Money - The Mythology of Money – The Story of Power:http://www.amazon.com/review/product/1930748035/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?%5Fencoding=UTF8&showViewpoints=1 Author Stephen Zarlenga's website on Monetary Reform: http://www.monetary.org I will be attending their annual monetary reform conference in Chicago this September, 2008. Zarlenga's book would be the best if it were simpler for the average person to follow and understand. It is deep, philosophical, scholarly, and a priceless treasure for those who really want to gain in-depth comprehension of the secret and hidden history of money and the power that flows from its control.

Best History, Comprehensive = Carrol Quigley - Tragedy and Hope: The History of the World in our Time: http://www.amazon.com/review/product/094500110X/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?%5Fencoding=UTF8&showViewpoints=1 This is an amazing expose' on the inside workings of the forces behind the NWO now being created in our world. It is actually now already an accomplished fact, and has been for about 40 or more years. It's big, long and complex, but it's the most educational book about the modern history of the NWO in existence, IMO. Quigley is a brilliant historian whose credentials are impecable. He was Bill Clinton's most influential professor and mentor.

Some good moments = Video: America: Freedom to Fascism : http://www.amazon.com/review/product/1930748035/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?%5Fencoding=UTF8&showViewpoints=1

An excellent capsule summary of many very important books that bear on the coming economic collapse: "How the World Really Works" http://www.amazon.com/review/product/0964084813/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?%5Fencoding=UTF8&showViewpoints=1 This book is especially important for its capsule summaries of the highlights of a handful of the most important books written in the last 50 years: A Century of War, Tragedy and Hope, The Naked Capitalist, The Tax-Exempt Foundations, The Creature from Jekyll Island, The Politics of Heroin, Dope Inc., and others. Disclaimer: I do not agree with the author's solutions. The book is valuable only for highlighting the problems.

These are factual resources of the highest integrity and scholarship - all of them.

FedFixNix
21st September 2008, 21:36
*** A short explanation of how we got to where we are:

Today's banking crisis is the THIRD trillion dollar plus US-caused financial meltdown in the last twenty years. Each one of these crises came into being through the same basic mechanism...the fraudulent over-valuing of financial assets by Wall Street - with a "wink and a nod" (and sometimes a lot more) from the White House and Congress.

The fraudulently valued assets stimulate the economy, impart the illusion of health and then, inevitably, the fraud goes too far and the whole house of card comes painfully crashing back to earth.

The three trillion dollar plus frauds were:

Fraud #1: The so-called "Savings and Loan Crisis" of the late 80s

Fraud #2: The so-called "Tech Bubble" of the late 90s

Fraud #3: The so-called "Credit Crisis" of today

*** How the scam works:

The mechanism of these frauds is simplicity itself...

...Take a shaky financial asset and blow up its value and then sell as much of it as you can.

In the "Savings and Loan Crisis," the instrument was junk bonds.

In the "Tech Bubble" it was Internet stocks.

In the "Credit Crisis" it was individual mortgages collected into pools and then re-sold to investors.

In each case, normal, well established "bread and butter" financial principles were consciously thrown away by Wall Street with no hint of protest from federal regulators.

***The "Savings and Loan Crisis" dissected:

Junk bonds caused the Saving and Loan crisis which resulted in the US taking over the assets of hundreds of banks and selling them back over time to the marketplace at fire sale prices.

Junk bonds, which caused the "Savings and Loan Crisis" were shaky bonds that were pumped up by deliberate misrepresentation and what I call "staged dealing."

Bonds get their value from two things: the amount of interest they pay and how safe they are.

"Junk" bonds have to pay higher interest because they are less safe. Therefore, until the "Savings and Loan Crisis," savings and loan banks banks were not allowed by law to buy them and call them assets.

Reagan/Bush changed all this and then a group of Wall Street fraudsters used the new loophole to kick off an orgy of junk bond creation and junk bond selling to banks and insurance companies.

The crooks would deal the junk bonds back and forth amongst themselves thereby establishing their "value" and then they'd sell them to outsiders. The bonds then became "assets" which could be borrowed against and leveraged to buy even more bonds.

When the bonds failed, the banks failed and in stepped the US government to "fix" the problem that it created at the cost of at least one trillion dollars to US tax payers.

Deja vu, eh?

***The "Tech Bubble" dissected:

The instrument of fraud in the "Tech Bubble" was Internet stocks, start ups in particular. A stock gets its value from the underlying company's sales, its growth and its overall prospects for the future.

Pre-tech bubble, companies used to have to prove themselves by being in existence for several years before they could be sold on major exchanges. That standard was thrown away during the tech bubble. To pump of their values, the companies engaged in "staged dealing" just like the junk bond crooks.

Company #1 would "sell" 20 million dollars in banner ads to Company #2 which would in turn "sell" 20 million in banner ads to Company #1.

In fact, nobody sold anybody anything. Company #2 ran ads for Company #1 and billed it for them. Company #1 ran ads for Company #2 and billed for an equal amount.

These should have been called media trades not sales, but Wall Street was happy to claim them as legitimate cash sales and then use the sales numbers to fraudulently value these companies - many of them totally worthless - in the hundreds of millions and sometimes even the billions.

***The "Credit Crisis" dissected:

By now, you see how the scheme works. It's not complicated at all.

You take near worthless pieces of paper (junk bonds, stock of start up Internet companies, etc.) and declare them to be good as gold.

Then you create as many junk bonds and Internet start up stocks as you get and sell them as fast as you can. In the case of our current crisis, the instrument of fraud was so-called sub-prime mortgages.

Previously, sub-prime mortgages had very little trading value. Only people in the sub-prime industry itself dealt in them and for good reason. They're tricky to value and packed with financial peril. But Wall Street changed all that.

Wall Street said: "If we take LOTS of these mortgages and assemble them into large pools and then slice and dice the pools in various ways, we can sell the slices to banks and other investors as AAA paper."

It sounds crazy, doesn't it?

If the underlying pieces of paper are garbage, how does assembling a whole bunch of garbage into one place make it "better?"

It doesn't, of course, and this is a principle even a three year old child can understand. But greed and the need to pump up a shaky economy for propaganda purposes are two very strong motivators.

Banks created these mortgage pools, sold them to each other, and they by virtue of these "staged sales" declared them valuable.

Do you recognize the pattern now?

If you do, then you are now smarter than all the assembled j@ck@sses who do financial reporting because they apparently can't - or won't.

This is the THIRD trillion-dollar plus fraud driven financial meltdown in twenty years and apparently no one in the financial news media can see how it happened.

***But there's more...

Junk bonds were mass manufactured as fast as the crooks could invent them. Ditto for Internet stocks.

But how did hundreds of billions of dollars worth of "toxic" mortgages suddenly come into being? Why did the mortgage industry change its lending standards so radically and so suddenly to make their creation possible? And why did real estate lending regulators in all 50 states - because real estate lending is a STATE-level issue not a federal - go along with it?

Here's where it gets very interesting...

The fact is state-level lending regulators were VERY concerned about what was going on. They have been for years.

And they not only expressed their concern clearly, they also took SERIOUS concerted legal action to stop lenders from making bad real estate loans to their citizens.

(Most of the sub-prime loans in the news so much today were designed to screw the people who borrowed the money and can rightly be called "predatory" loans.)

Guess who stopped the states from enforcing their own time-proven real estate lending laws and thus created the raw material that made the current "Credit Crisis" possible?

*** The trillion dollar plus question

If you're a US taxpayer, you're going to pay for this fraud so you might as well know who did it to you.

His initials are GB. You know him well.

But perhaps more interesting is the name of the person who single-handedly rallied first state attorneys general and then fellow governors to fight the creation of these loans and who in the process became Public Enemy #1 to the Bush Administration...

His initials are ES.

If you follow "silly" US political scandals, you'll recognize his name instantly when you hear it. And you will *finally* understand why he was quickly and permanently assassinated politically earlier this year.

Had ES been allowed to "live," he would have been in position to remind everyone every day of who made the current meltdown possible.

Instead, he was silenced very effectively. Not with a bullet in the back of the head, but the net effect was just the same.

So effective was his assassination that no one can even mention his name in connection with today's crisis without risking ridicule, or worse.

Last note:

The crisis this fraud has created is *exponentially* bigger than the S & L and Tech Bubble combined.

It's not going to be resolved by a quick "patch up" and will likely have the same impact on the current generation that the depression of the 1930s had on its parents, grandparents and great grandparents.

On that cheerful note, here's the big story everyone missed this year and now you'll finally know what REALLY happened and why:

Elliot Spitzer - The Assasination:

http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/291.html

Don't miss this video.

FedFixNix
21st September 2008, 21:42
The Mafia, the CIA and Bush Sr: Roots of the Savings & Loan Scandal

http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/411.html

The S & L Bust and Bailout was just a tuneup for what is happening today. It was an indicator of just how little the citizens of this nation cared or understood about our money and banking system, and what the Money Masters and Banksters could get away with.

Watch it and weep.

Kelly
22nd September 2008, 11:00
Hey Nixie, good to see you back from vacation!

These are some great posts and you're right on the money about what has been going on behind the scenes.

I watched the "Mafia, CIA and Bush" video about the Savings and Loan meltdown, and it is oh, so true. The one thing I learned from that infamous international lawyer I knew was his role in this whole thing and how the Mafia and CIA were holding hands. And curious thing; Mr. Banker was in Florida at precisely the same time as the video says, THEN he went to Texas...

The role BCCI played in the S & L meltdown was utterly huge. That lawyer's Saudi friends, the ones he used to set up BCCI, and the Saudis were also in league with the Bush's, the Mafia and CIA. The whole damn thing was part of the set up that led to the Iran/Contra affair. These guys had been planning the whole thing for just years and years.

As far as the junk bond bubble that started the end of the savings and loans, all during 1985-86 that lawyer sat in his penthouse apartment and traded those junk bonds, building the bubble up. He was actually doing his trades over the web, and the trades were made to look like they were coming out of Europe even though they were coming out of America. Curiously enough there was no public internet in 1985. However, that same banker-lawyer also owned one of the telecommunication companies that got contracts from the CIA and military and his company was one of the 65 international companies that actually helped set up the web in the first place. He had exactly the same access to the web that the military had in the early 80's and he was using that access in the attempt to destroy our economy.

Back in 85' he believed this whole thing was going to result in a "Great Depression" styled meltdown, and he was looking forward to it, promising that "blood will run in the streets." At the time, I thought he was just nuts, and believed that nobody could actually manipulate a depression. (Shows you how naïve I was!) You simply can't imagine the utter horror I felt when "Black Monday" hit in October of 1987.

This whole web of deceit is so intertwined I doubt that we'll ever be able to unravel it all.

FedFixNix
22nd September 2008, 17:54
Hey Nixie, good to see you back from vacation!

Thanks. Good to be back, if only for a few days. Off midweek to Chicago for a Monetary Reform Conference sponsored by AMI www.monetary.org


These are some great posts and you're right on the money about what has been going on behind the scenes.

Thanks again, only these barely even scratch the surface of the utter corruptions that has its tenacles into our nation and world.


I watched the "Mafia, CIA and Bush" video about the Savings and Loan meltdown, and it is oh, so true. The one thing I learned from that infamous international lawyer I knew was his role in this whole thing and how the Mafia and CIA were holding hands. And curious thing; Mr. Banker was in Florida at precisely the same time as the video says, THEN he went to Texas...

You're personal experience and research have validated these videos for you, as my experiences and research have done for me. These videos are factual documentaries. But they are only the tip of a huge iceberg that few people can comprehend. Nor will they until it all explodes in their faces, with fatal or disastrous results.


The role BCCI played in the S & L meltdown was utterly huge. That lawyer's Saudi friends, the ones he used to set up BCCI, and the Saudis were also in league with the Bush's, the Mafia and CIA. The whole damn thing was part of the set up that led to the Iran/Contra affair. These guys had been planning the whole thing for just years and years.

As far as the junk bond bubble that started the end of the savings and loans, all during 1985-86 that lawyer sat in his penthouse apartment and traded those junk bonds, building the bubble up. He was actually doing his trades over the web, and the trades were made to look like they were coming out of Europe even though they were coming out of America. Curiously enough there was no public internet in 1985. However, that same banker-lawyer also owned one of the telecommunication companies that got contracts from the CIA and military and his company was one of the 65 international companies that actually helped set up the web in the first place. He had exactly the same access to the web that the military had in the early 80's and he was using that access in the attempt to destroy our economy.

Back in 85' he believed this whole thing was going to result in a "Great Depression" styled meltdown, and he was looking forward to it, promising that "blood will run in the streets." At the time, I thought he was just nuts, and believed that nobody could actually manipulate a depression. (Shows you how naïve I was!) You simply can't imagine the utter horror I felt when "Black Monday" hit in October of 1987.

This whole web of deceit is so intertwined I doubt that we'll ever be able to unravel it all.

I've unraveled much of it. The problem is that no one is listening. No one cares about another "conspiracy theory". People have lives to live, things to do, places to go, bills to pay... and so on. They think that if they watch an hour of Fux Propaganda News a week they've informed themselves. Of course old Rupert also owns the Wall Street Journal and Washington post too, so those who read those propaganda sheets also think they are getting news, instead of the party line.

It would be funny if it weren't so fatal. :(

More later about the CIA, Wall Street Banker, DEA, Drug cartel, political and other connections. I have direct experience in those areas that also validates my own research done over many, many years. The truth is so much stranger than fiction that often people have to write it as such, and hope the smart ones make the connection.

averagejoe
22nd September 2008, 23:21
I've tried futally to talk to people about what is going on and it's as if they would rather stick their head in the sand and pretend that everything is going to be fine. Ignorance is bliss syndrome, sad thing is when they finally awaken from their stupor it is going to be too late! It just really pisses me off how niave some people can be.

cdavport
22nd September 2008, 23:45
I've tried futally to talk to people about what is going on and it's as if they would rather stick their head in the sand and pretend that everything is going to be fine. Ignorance is bliss syndrome, sad thing is when they finally awaken from their stupor it is going to be too late! It just really pisses me off how niave some people can be.


You got that right!! I have a good friend with half a lifetime of savings in his 401. I talk to I am blue, then feed him articles that would make a gold bug buy silver, and he just can't see it. He keeps saying that that can't happen here, and I'm saying, man, IT IS HAPPENING HERE! If he wasn't such a good guy I would have long given up on him, but whatayuh gonna do?

FedFixNix
23rd September 2008, 00:11
You got that right!! I have a good friend with half a lifetime of savings in his 401. I talk to I am blue, then feed him articles that would make a gold bug buy silver, and he just can't see it. He keeps saying that that can't happen here, and I'm saying, man, IT IS HAPPENING HERE! If he wasn't such a good guy I would have long given up on him, but whatayuh gonna do?

Most of us have loved ones, friends and relatives who fit that bill. Financial ignorance is nealry universal, even among people who think they know the markets. First we have to educate ourselves. Then we can, perhaps, inform a few others.

Gandhi went into a seemingly hopeless situation in India, and peacefully overturned the British establishment and took back their government. Anything is possible, but it requires dedication and effort.

"First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win."

Kelly
23rd September 2008, 04:00
Spam, Spam, Green Eggs And Ham...

Get Off Of This Forum, You Freaking Troll! Now!

pkrebaum
23rd September 2008, 08:30
Presumptions:
1) out of 40 million or so home mortgages 12 million are in trouble.
2) these bailouts will cost a minimum of 1.2 trillion dollars (perhaps 4.6 trillion ?)
3) the system will collapse and we'll all die if this thing isn't fixed.

lop off the excess zeros.... 12 into 1,200,000 is $100,000 per homeowner, minimum !

So why bail out the fat cats when it would be less expensive to just give the money directly to the homeowners ? That would solve the problem..... after bailing out the fat cats we STILL have 12 million homeowners who are in trouble.... THEIR problem is still unsolved.

Well, in America we have this puritanical moral code which puts emphasis on punishing individuals. Corporate welfare, criminality, and irresponsibility is much less frowned upon (encouraged even) than the same bad traits in individual people. Handouts to average joes bad, handouts to corporations good. The same can be said for Katrina. If all the money that was pledged for Katrina had been put in individual escrow accounts for cleanup and new home construction New Orleans would have been rebuilt by now.

Then again, putting the money back into the people's hands directly wouldn't privatize the profits and socialize the losses.... today it's a sin not to launder any money stream thru Wall Street (including narco dollars, but that's a whole different can of worms). Just like the S&L scandal, all this stuff we taxpayers have paid for will be sold back to the fat cats at fire sale prices so they can do it all over again and extract (5 trillion ???) from our pockets a few years into the future. Paying the homeowners would solve their problem, prevent the future (5 trillion ?) future extraction, and leave the economy in a position where we could let a lot of these bad investment makers fail without screwing up everyone's retirement accounts. And by everyone I mean the other 99% who don't know about Gold and Silver.

So how would you vote ?
1) help the homeowners directly.
2) bailout the fat cats.
3) let it collapse, it won't be as bad as they say it will be (and all who don't own Gold and Silver will get their just desserts for being such silly fools and not listening to us...).

Kelly
23rd September 2008, 09:47
Presumptions:
1) out of 40 million or so home mortgages 12 million are in trouble.
2) these bailouts will cost a minimum of 1.2 trillion dollars (perhaps 4.6 trillion ?)
3) the system will collapse and we'll all die if this thing isn't fixed.

lop off the excess zeros.... 12 into 1,200,000 is $100,000 per homeowner, minimum !

So why bail out the fat cats when it would be less expensive to just give the money directly to the homeowners ? That would solve the problem..... after bailing out the fat cats we STILL have 12 million homeowners who are in trouble.... THEIR problem is still unsolved.

I'd much rather bail out the homeowners, althogh I'm sure there are some (at least one) who will say "Listen to yourself! You're supporting the "Poor Mes".

But the truth is, I'd much rather support American people, than to turn this money over to the very financial institutions who are responsible for robbing this country blind in the first place.

I am sincerely afraid that whatever the senate decides, this whole situation will be used to solidify a pure dictatorship for the Fed and will set a precedent for bailing out the banks.

(By the way, there really was a spammer on this forum late last night. His post is gone now, and for some reason I can't delete my above post.)

JD4x4
23rd September 2008, 11:12
While using your previously posted references, I found just what I needed to send to my legislators (which I have just finished doing and will urge everyone to do NOW as well):


My desire as your constituent, simply put:

Under the Constitution, Article I, Sec. 8, our government has the sovereign power to issue money and spend it into circulation to promote the general welfare through the creation and repair of infrastructure, including human infrastructure - health and education - rather than misusing the money system for speculation as banking has historically done, periodically causing one crisis after another.

Our lawmakers must now reclaim that power!

Respectfully,
xxxxx

Thanks again for those links.

Kelly
23rd September 2008, 11:44
Please folks, go to congress.org and write your congresspeople and tell them what you REALLY think about this bail out. This site makes it very easy to find your senators and reps and it's no hassle at all.

http://www.congress.org/congressorg/home/

If we ALL write, maybe, just maybe, they won't pass this awful thing.

Most Americans today are having a hard enough time just supporting their families. We don't need to support fat cats who took millions in bonuses for making bad decisions too. Let the rich help the rich; but get them off our backs!

If this thing passes, you can count on it, super-inflation AND a continued reduction of available credit will be the outcome.

It's YOUR future, so write those letters!

FedFixNix
23rd September 2008, 12:53
While using your previously posted references, I found just what I needed to send to my legislators (which I have just finished doing and will urge everyone to do NOW as well):


My desire as your constituent, simply put:

Under the Constitution, Article I, Sec. 8, our government has the sovereign power to issue money and spend it into circulation to promote the general welfare through the creation and repair of infrastructure, including human infrastructure - health and education - rather than misusing the money system for speculation as banking has historically done, periodically causing one crisis after another.

Our lawmakers must now reclaim that power!

Respectfully,
xxxxx

Thanks again for those links.

JC4x4 ... someone who really seems to "get it". You are a really rare bird... nearly extinct, but not quite.

That is a key phrase in the Monetary Reform Act that Steve Zarlenga's American Monetary Institute has been working toward for over the last 10 years. www.monetqry.org

I'm going to attend their annual conference in Chicago from Wednesday AM to Sunday night this week. With all that is happening it should be very interesting.

Ellen Hodgson Brown, the Author of Web of Debt: The Shocking Truth about our Money System... How We Got Trapped...and How We Can Break Free. www.webofdebt.com

Of course Zarlenga is the Author of The Lost Science of Money.

These two books are the ONLY really accurate and up to date works on how (we the people) can take back our money and our government. Each of these cites scores or even hundreds of scholarly, but generally suppressed, works on monetary theory and practice.... especially practice!!!

I urge everyone who wants to dispel the darkness we appear trapped in to obtain and read these key books.

JD4x4
23rd September 2008, 13:07
... You are a really rare bird... nearly extinct, but not quite.

If you knew me, and especially how old I am you'd know how right you are about extinction! ;)

Kelly
23rd September 2008, 13:13
JD - I'd like to personally thank you for posting that paragraph about our contitutional rights. I quickly copied it into the body of the letters I just e-mailed off to my state senators in my VOTE NO ON THE BAILOUT letter to them.

Folks, it only takes a minute or two to compose a reasonably intelligent letter and get it off off to your senators. Please tell them "No" on the bail out and tell them to get rid of the Fed!

FedFixNix
23rd September 2008, 14:10
Please folks, go to congress.org and write your congresspeople and tell them what you REALLY think about this bail out. This site makes it very easy to find your senators and reps and it's no hassle at all.

http://www.congress.org/congressorg/home/

If we ALL write, maybe, just maybe, they won't pass this awful thing.

Most Americans today are having a hard enough time just supporting their families. We don't need to support fat cats who took millions in bonuses for making bad decisions too. Let the rich help the rich; but get them off our backs!

If this thing passes, you can count on it, super-inflation AND a continued reduction of available credit will be the outcome.

It's YOUR future, so write those letters!

Couldn't agree more.

1. Our government must take back the power to create our money from the privately owned and controlled FED System! This simply means returning to the constitutional mandates that "CONGRESS" alone has the authority to issue and regulate money. That, in turn means to take over the Federal Reserve System, and incorporate it into our government, and under government oversight and regulation. This is what almost everyone thinks is the way it works now because they have been deceived.

Once that happens:

2. Rather than bailouts, the government should place these bankrupt companies into receivership... ALL of them... especially the banks and financial institutions. We, the taxpayers are already picking up the costs and losses from raging criminal plundering of their assets and stockholder equity. We need to stop subsidizing monopolies, and either break up these huge TBTF trusts or make them part of the government.

3. We need to gradually and systematically eliminate fractional reserve banking, effectively taking away their power to create credit money out of nothing.

There's more, but I am out of time.

Write those letters! Use those links to congress Kelly posted! Don't just sit on your hands. Do what you can, while you can. The internet will not be open for these purposes much longer.

And be of good cheer! :smile:

FedFixNix
23rd September 2008, 15:31
The gold standard is NOT the answer!

If you believe it is, read the books or watch the videos listed. Here is one short argument about how the architects of the NWO look at gold as their tool and road to power. Skip down to #7 if you lack time:

http://www.apfn.org/THEWINDS/library/protocols_of_zion.html#preface

PROTOCOLS OF THE MEETINGS OF THE LEARNED ELDERS OF ZION

[Ed. Note: This document is thought by many scholars to be the mother of all NWO manifestos of every stripe and color, everywhere. Many call it a "forgery" or scream that it is anti-semitic, but that is not the case at all. It a Zionist NWO manifesto, verifiably written at least a hundred years ago. Wheter you think it a fake or not, everything written in it has come to pass, or is now in the process of taking place. It is guaranteed to make you as mad as the Massive Taxpayer Bailout that is one of its many results. FFN]

PROTOCOL No. 1

1. ....Putting aside fine phrases we shall speak of the significance of each thought: by comparisons and deductions we shall throw light upon surrounding facts.

2. What I am about to set forth, then, is our system from the two points of view, that of ourselves and that of the GOYIM [i.e., non- Jews].

3. It must be noted that men with bad instincts are more in number than the good, and therefore the best results in governing them are attained by violence and terrorisation, and not by academic discussions. Every man aims at power, everyone would like to become a dictator if only he could, and rare indeed are the men who would not be willing to sacrifice the welfare of all for the sake of securing their own welfare.

4. What has restrained the beasts of prey who are called men? What has served for their guidance hitherto?

5. In the beginnings of the structure of society, they were subjected to brutal and blind force; after words - to Law, which is the same force, only disguised. I draw the conclusion that by the law of nature right lies in force.

6. Political freedom is an idea but not a fact. This idea one must know how to apply whenever it appears necessary with this bait of an idea to attract the masses of the people to one's party for the purpose of crushing another who is in authority. This task is rendered easier of the opponent has himself been infected with the idea of freedom, SO-CALLED LIBERALISM, and, for the sake of an idea, is willing to yield some of his power. It is precisely here that the triumph of our theory appears; the slackened reins of government are immediately, by the law of life, caught up and gathered together by a new hand, because the blind might of the nation cannot for one single day exist without guidance, and the new authority merely fits into the place of the old already weakened by liberalism.

GOLD

7. In our day the power which has replaced that of the rulers who were liberal is the power of Gold. Time was when Faith ruled. The idea of freedom is impossible of realization because no one knows how to use it with moderation. It is enough to hand over a people to self-government for a certain length of time for that people to be turned into a disorganized mob. From that moment on we get internecine strife which soon develops into battles between classes, in the midst of which States burn down and their importance is reduced to that of a heap of ashes.

8. Whether a State exhausts itself in its own convulsions, whether its internal discord brings it under the power of external foes - in any case it can be accounted irretrievable lost: IT IS IN OUR POWER. The despotism of Capital, which is entirely in our hands, reaches out to it a straw that the State, willy-nilly, must take hold of: if not - it goes to the bottom.

9. Should anyone of a liberal mind say that such reflections as the above are immoral, I would put the following questions: If every State has two foes and if in regard to the external foe it is allowed and not considered immoral to use every manner and art of conflict, as for example to keep the enemy in ignorance of plans of attack and defense, to attack him by night or in superior numbers, then in what way can the same means in regard to a worse foe, the destroyer of the structure of society and the commonweal, be called immoral and not permissible?

10. Is it possible for any sound logical mind to hope with any success to guide crowds by the aid of reasonable counsels and arguments, when any objection or contradiction, senseless though it may be, can be made and when such objection may find more favor with the people, whose powers of reasoning are superficial? Men in masses and the men of the masses, being guided solely by petty passions, paltry beliefs, traditions and sentimental theorems, fall a prey to party dissension, which hinders any kind of agreement even on the basis of a perfectly reasonable argument. Every resolution of a crowd depends upon a chance or packed majority, which, in its ignorance of political secrets, puts forth some ridiculous resolution that lays in the administration a seed of anarchy.

11. The political has nothing in common with the moral. The ruler who is governed by the moral is not a skilled politician, and is therefore unstable on his throne. He who wishes to rule must have recourse both to cunning and to make-believe. Great national qualities, like frankness and honesty, are vices in politics, for they bring down rulers from their thrones more effectively and more certainly than the most powerful enemy. Such qualities must be the attributes of the kingdoms of the GOYIM, but we must in no wise be guided by them.

http://www.apfn.org/THEWINDS/library/protocols_of_zion.html#preface

The acquisition and use of gold as currency and bills of trade is the very foundation upon which the totalitarian economic NWO is being built. Gold is no longer useful to them, excecpt as a backup plan B, if their current plan A fails. Then they will start "plan A" all over again... remix to 1913 and 1929, rewind, and repeat.

To those who really want to understand how deep the roots of our current problems are, I urge you to read the entire text. If you have read and understand history, your blood will curdle and your hair will stand straight up. :twisted:

Cheers,

FedFixNix
23rd September 2008, 22:30
Presumptions:
1) out of 40 million or so home mortgages 12 million are in trouble.
2) these bailouts will cost a minimum of 1.2 trillion dollars (perhaps 4.6 trillion ?)
3) the system will collapse and we'll all die if this thing isn't fixed.

lop off the excess zeros.... 12 into 1,200,000 is $100,000 per homeowner, minimum !

So why bail out the fat cats when it would be less expensive to just give the money directly to the homeowners ? That would solve the problem..... after bailing out the fat cats we STILL have 12 million homeowners who are in trouble.... THEIR problem is still unsolved.

Well, in America we have this puritanical moral code which puts emphasis on punishing individuals. Corporate welfare, criminality, and irresponsibility is much less frowned upon (encouraged even) than the same bad traits in individual people. Handouts to average joes bad, handouts to corporations good. The same can be said for Katrina. If all the money that was pledged for Katrina had been put in individual escrow accounts for cleanup and new home construction New Orleans would have been rebuilt by now.

Then again, putting the money back into the people's hands directly wouldn't privatize the profits and socialize the losses.... today it's a sin not to launder any money stream thru Wall Street (including narco dollars, but that's a whole different can of worms). Just like the S&L scandal, all this stuff we taxpayers have paid for will be sold back to the fat cats at fire sale prices so they can do it all over again and extract (5 trillion ???) from our pockets a few years into the future. Paying the homeowners would solve their problem, prevent the future (5 trillion ?) future extraction, and leave the economy in a position where we could let a lot of these bad investment makers fail without screwing up everyone's retirement accounts. And by everyone I mean the other 99% who don't know about Gold and Silver.

So how would you vote ?
1) help the homeowners directly.
2) bailout the fat cats.
3) let it collapse, it won't be as bad as they say it will be (and all who don't own Gold and Silver will get their just desserts for being such silly fools and not listening to us...).

There is much I would comment on here, but I lack time now. Perhaps after I return from the monetary reform conference next week.

Of couse #1, helping the homeowners directly, is the only moral and sensible answer. Only it could be don in a way that no one is suggesting, and would cost taxpayers nothing, (perhaps even bring a long term return to the treasury) and save most from bankruptcy and default on their home loans.

This would involve the government directly refinancing these mortgage loans at a lower rate and longer term, say 40 or 50 years, instead of 30, or a fixed rate for an fluctuating ARM.

The homeowner wins, the taxpayers win, the banksters lose a little but probably less than under any current insanity they are considering, and the nation prospers in the long run.

Of course this is contingent on the homeowner being able to maintain reduced loan payments over a longer period of time. However, if you make the loan assumable, even that contingency could avoid bankruptcy, default and loss to the overall economy.

There are other options I could add, but this is the best one I can think of short of total monetary reforms we advocate and are working toward.

www.monetary.org

www.webofdebt.com

Cheers,

chux03
23rd September 2008, 22:42
While using your previously posted references, I found just what I needed to send to my legislators (which I have just finished doing and will urge everyone to do NOW as well):


My desire as your constituent, simply put:

Under the Constitution, Article I, Sec. 8, our government has the sovereign power to issue money and spend it into circulation to promote the general welfare through the creation and repair of infrastructure, including human infrastructure - health and education - rather than misusing the money system for speculation as banking has historically done, periodically causing one crisis after another.

Our lawmakers must now reclaim that power!

Respectfully,
xxxxx

Thanks again for those links.


That's short, sweet and to the point. Lots of thought packed in few words. THANKS!! I've copied that down and will suggest that when others may want to write to their personal political hack in Washington DC.

pkrebaum
24th September 2008, 07:42
"If the underlying pieces of paper are garbage, how does assembling a whole bunch of garbage into one place make it "better?"
It doesn't, of course, and this is a principle even a three year old child can understand. " -FFN

this, along with the current FBI investigation into these failed banks, reminds me of a song.....
.....just wait a second while it comes around on the guitar....

from: Alice's Restaurant
By Arlo Guthrie

......."We got up there, we found all the garbage in there, and we decided it'd be a friendly gesture for us to take the garbage down to the city dump. So we took the half a ton of garbage, put it in the back of a red VW
microbus, took shovels and rakes and implements of destruction and headed
on toward the city dump.

Well we got there and there was a big sign and a chain across across the
dump saying, "Closed on Thanksgiving." And we had never heard of a dump
closed on Thanksgiving before, and with tears in our eyes we drove off
into the sunset looking for another place to put the garbage.

We didn't find one. Until we came to a side road, and off the side of the
side road there was another fifteen foot cliff and at the bottom of the
cliff there was another pile of garbage. And we decided that one big pile
is better than two little piles, and rather than bring that one up we
decided to throw our's down.

That's what we did, and drove back to the church, had a thanksgiving
dinner that couldn't be beat, went to sleep and didn't get up until the
next morning, when we got a phone call from officer Obie. He said, "Kid,
we found your name on an envelope at the bottom of a half a ton of
garbage, and just wanted to know if you had any information about it." ......

FedFixNix
24th September 2008, 13:47
Some of the best info I've yet seen on the kinds of reforms that are needed:

http://www.sustecweb.co.uk/past/sustec82/index.htm#eleven

FedFixNix
24th September 2008, 13:57
While using your previously posted references, I found just what I needed to send to my legislators (which I have just finished doing and will urge everyone to do NOW as well):


My desire as your constituent, simply put:

Under the Constitution, Article I, Sec. 8, our government has the sovereign power to issue money and spend it into circulation to promote the general welfare through the creation and repair of infrastructure, including human infrastructure - health and education - rather than misusing the money system for speculation as banking has historically done, periodically causing one crisis after another.

Our lawmakers must now reclaim that power!

Respectfully,
xxxxx

Thanks again for those links.

JD, You are welcome - And I may be closer to extinction than you! ;)

I might add references to Web of Debt and The Lost Science of Money, and the American Monetary Institute's act on Monetary Transparency and Reform.

Secrecy, no regulation or oversight, no audits, no accounting... these are all huge parts of the problems that must be corrected.

Or we simply go down the tubes!

FedFixNix
24th September 2008, 14:32
My desire as your constituent, simply put:

Under the Constitution, Article I, Sec. 8, our government has the sovereign power to issue money and spend it into circulation to promote the general welfare through the creation and repair of infrastructure, including human infrastructure - health and education - rather than misusing the money system for speculation as banking has historically done, periodically causing one crisis after another.

Our lawmakers must now reclaim that power!

Respectfully,
xxxxx


JD's short composition is the heart of all of the monetary reforms I've advocated ever since first posting to this forum. It is the heart of the reforms in all of the books and videos I constantly advocate that people read or watch.

It is also at the heart of all of the comments and warnings by our finest and brightest presidents, statesmen, and philosophers. Some of them are below:

The Government should create, issue, and circulate all the currency and credit needed to satisfy spending power of the Government and the buying of consumers. The privilege of creating and issuing money is not only the supreme prerogative of Governments, but it is the government's greatest creative opportunity. By the adoption of these principles, the long-felt want for a uniform medium will be satisfied. The taxpayers will be saved immense sums of interest. The financing of all public enterprises, and the conduct of he Treasury will become matters of practical administration. Money will cease to be master and become the servant of humanity. ABRAHAM LINCOLN

If the American people ever allow the banks to control the issuance of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and the corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of al property until their children will wake up homeless on the continent their fathers occupied. The issuing of money should be taken from the banks and restored to Congress and to the people tho whom it belongs. I sincerely believe that banking institutions having the issuing power of money are more dangerous to liberty than standing armies. - Thomas Jefferson, quoted in The Story of our Money by Olive Cushing Dwinell

"This institution (National Bank) is one of the most deadly hostilities existing, against the principles and form of our Constitution.. . ... I deem no government safe which is under the vassalage of any self-constituted authorities, or any other authority than that of the nation. . . .What an obstruction could not this Bank of the United States, with all its branch banks, be in time of war? It might dictate to us the peace we should accept.. .Now, while we are strong, it is the greatest debt we owe to the safety of our Constitution, to being its powerful enemy to a perfect subordination under its authorities." ― Thomas Jefferson 1803

“It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning.” - Henry Ford

“The Federal Reserve (Bank) is one of the most corrupt institutions the world has ever seen. There is not a man within the sound of my voice who does not know that this Nation is run by the International Bankers.” ― Congressman Louis T. McFadden

My agency in promoting the passage of the National Bank Act was the greatest financial mistake of my life. It has built up the monopoly which affects every interest in the country. It should be repealed; but before that can be accomplished, the people will be arrayed on one side and the banks on the other, in a contest such as we have never seen before in this country. SALMON M. CHASE

Under the Federal Reserve Act panics are scientifically created; the present panic is the first scientifically created one, worked out as we figure a mathematical problem. HON. CHARLES A. LINDBERGH SR., writing of the Panic of 1920

The few who can understand the system (check, money and credits) will either be so interested in its profits, or so dependent on its favors, that there will be no opposition from that class, while on the other hand, the great body of the people, mentally incapable of comprehending the tremendous advantage that capital derives from the system, will bear its burdens without complaint, and perhaps without even suspecting that the system is inimical to their interest. -- ROTHSCHILD BROTHERS OF LONDON

"We have been truly sowing the wind, and are now reaping the whirlwind. If the present crisis should end in the annihilation of these interlopers (the bankers) only, and reduce our commerce to the measure of our own wants and surplus products, it will be a benefit in the end. but how to effect this, and give time to real capital, and the holders of real property, to back out of their entanglements requires more knowledge of political economy than we possess.. .THE EYES OF OUR CITIZENS ARE NOT SUFFICIENTLY OPEN TO THE TRUE CAUSE OF OUR DISTRESS. THEY ASCRIBE THEM TO EVERYTHING BUT THEIR TRUE CAUSE, THE BANKING SYSTEM!" ― Thomas Jefferson 1819

“The few who understand the system, will either be so interested in its profits, or so dependent on its favors, that there will be no opposition from that class. The great body of people, mentally incapable of comprehending the tremendous advantages, will bear its burden without complaint.” -Rothschild Brothers of London, 1863-Jun-25, in a letter to fellow members of the establishment

“The best time to buy is when blood is running in the streets.” -- Baron Nathan Mayer de Rothschild

“We have now sunk to a depth at which restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men.” - George Orwell

“In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” - George Orwell

While boasting of our noble deeds, we are careful to conceal the ugly fact that by our iniquitous money system we have nationalized a system of oppression which through more refined, is no less cruel than the old system of chattel slavery. -- HORACE GREELY

. The people have an instinct which tells them that something is wrong and that the wrong somehow centers in money. Don't allow them to confuse you and with the cry of "paper money." The danger of paper money is precisely the danger of gold - if you get too much it is no good. There is just one rule for money and that is to have enough to carry all the legitimate trade that is waiting to move. Too little and too much are both bad. But enough to move trade, enough to prevent stagnation on the one hand, not enough to permit speculation on the other hand, is the proper ratio. If your nation can use a dollar bond, it can issue a dollar bill. The element that makes the bond good, makes the bill good also. The difference between the bond and the bill is that the bond lets money brokers collect the amount of the bond and an additional 20% interest, whereas the currency pays nobody but those who contribute directly to it in some useful way. It is absurd to say that our country can issue $30,000,000 in bonds and not $30,000,000 in currency. Both are promises to pay, but one promise fattens the owner and the other helps the people. It is the people who constitute the basis government credit. Whey then cannot people have the benefit of their own gilt-edge credit by receiving non-interest bearing currency - instead of bankers receiving the benefit of the people's credit in interest-bearing bonds? If the United States Government will adopt this policy of increasing its national wealth without contributing to the interest collector - for the whole national debt is made up on interest charges - then you will see an era of progress and prosperity in this country such as could never have come otherwise. -- THOMAS A. EDISON

From the testimony of Marriner Eccles, Chairman of the Federal Reserve Board, before the House Banking and Currency Committee, Sept. 30, 1941:
Congressman Patman: "Mr. Eccles, how did you get the money to buy those two billions of government securities?"
Eccles: "We created it."
Patman: "Out of what?"
Eccles: "Out of the right to issue credit money."

"Permit me to issue and control the money of a nation, and I care not who
makes its laws!" ― Mayer Anselm Rothschild

Kelly
24th September 2008, 14:48
Secrecy, no regulation or oversight, no audits, no accounting... these are all huge parts of the problems that must be corrected.

I don't think Bernanke and Paulsen are going to get their way. The bailout may indeed happen, but congress is in no mood to hand them that kind of money and power with no congressional oversight.

Regardless of how congress votes on this bailout, from the looks of things it's pretty much a given that regulation of the banking and financial institutions as well as the market is going to return in spades. Congress is actively calling for "more transparency and congressional oversight" in anything that effects the economy, and by the time the FBI gets done investigating the banks and institutions that have already been bailed out, I suspect anybody even vaguely connected with banking is going to realize that the days of cookin' the books are over. I am personally in sincere hopes that the idea of an FBI audit of one's financial institution provokes the same sort of fear and loathing we citizens feel at the idea of an IRS audit.

If congress actually acts on their sentiment, the banking industry and the markets are going to have some severe curbs placed on them. I don't know how long it can last; we can bet the banks will begin lobbying to deregulate things again immediately, but I think the only good thing from this whole mess is that it really does look like congress got a wake up call!

Right now, my single biggest fear is that congress will demand the time they need to find a more realistic solution, and in the mean time; we still have a very petulant man sitting in the oval office who pretty much demands to have his way.

Let us not forget my friends that EXECUTIVE ORDER 11051 specifies the responsibility of the Office of Emergency Planning and gives authorization to put all Executive Orders into effect in times of increased international tensions and economic or financial crisis. (Oh do note the words "economic or financial crisis!")

In other words, if the President decides to officially declare this an economic crisis, that prick in the oval office can declare martial law.

FedFixNix
24th September 2008, 15:02
Back in 2000, I publicly wrote all over the internet that the one good thing that might result from the Supreme Court selection of GWB as president is that it would result in such disaster and calamity that it would take decades for the bankster scoundrels to EVER get back into power.

Boy was I wrong. 2004 proved to me that the people have an infinite capacity for ignorance and stupidity.... no limits at all on those commodities!

Now we are headed into 2008 facing the worst crisis the world and our nation has EVER IMAGINED and major candidates in a virtual tie! It would not surprise me in the least if the slave-masters got elected again! We vote for our chains and our misery, and they convince us we are doing the right thing. If you spend enough money on the right advertising and packaging you can sell manure to people at tenderloin prices!

And that is repeatedly proven to me endlessly, every day, every year of my 70 years on this insane planet.

Beam me up Scotty....

.... no intelligent life down here. :(

Bye!

FedFixNix
24th September 2008, 18:54
Let us not forget my friends that EXECUTIVE ORDER 11051 specifies the responsibility of the Office of Emergency Planning and gives authorization to put all Executive Orders into effect in times of increased international tensions and economic or financial crisis. (Oh do note the words "economic or financial crisis!")

In other words, if the President decides to officially declare this an economic crisis, that prick in the oval office can declare martial law.

Again Kelly nails it ! This is what I have been warning about since 2000, when the consummate fascist got elected. I've been warning about the drift to fascism this nation has taken since I read 1984 in 1956 while I was in the military service.

If there is a chance the democrats will win the election an emergency will be invented to prevent it.

sliver
26th September 2008, 00:55
I sent a letter to my senator and also to my representative expressing my concern about the predatory practices of the credit card companies and our financial institutions. I was aware that draft legislation was being prepared for later action by congress. In my letter I stated that a cap should be put on these business concerns limiting the total amount a enterprise could charge in penalties, fees, and interest. My suggestion was in the neighborhood of 15%.
If they couldn't survive with that large a margin they should find another line of business. I also said these predatory practices were done by thieves and these corporations should be treated as thieves. In addition I said that usury laws should be reinstated and the word placed back in the congressional dictionary.
I received a nice letter back from the senator stating what they were recommending for wording in the new legislation. There was nothing in there about capping fees or about penalties. I've got another rough draft prepared bringing that up. I hope readers here will also reflect their concern with their representatives. I wasn't concerned for myself, I can pay off any of my bills tomorrow if I wish. I hate to see the poor preyed upon.
Sliver

balou2
26th September 2008, 02:12
I must admit, while I don't think this is going to be an agreeable package, regardless how it shakes out, I am less mentally impaled since Congress slowed down the process a bit. I was extremely nervous that the administration would pull out the check book, with the only question being, "how many zero's?" This is the first time in my life I've seen the American people speak up in a way that if nothing else, Congress knows that we don't believe what they're doing is right. Now, if they'd only listen.

FedFixNix
7th October 2008, 01:04
Does it bring regulation and oversight back into the money and banking industry?

Does it bring honest accounting and transparency into our monetary system, the Federal Reserve, and the Treasury?

Is it going to stabilize our insanely gyrating economy and markets?

Is it going to help ordinary people stay in their homes and avoid foreclosure and bankruptcy?

Is it going to do any of the intended fixes to our financial system?

Or is is just another Trillion dollar bunko scheme to enrich the rich and tax the poor and middle classes?

I know my answers to these and many other questions. Just wondering how others might view it. :mad:

skijake
7th October 2008, 01:23
Does it bring regulation and oversight back into the money and banking industry?

Does it bring honest accounting and transparency into our monetary system, the Federal Reserve, and the Treasury?

Is it going to stabilize our insanely gyrating economy and markets?

Is it going to help ordinary people stay in their homes and avoid foreclosure and bankruptcy?

Is it going to do any of the intended fixes to our financial system?

Or is is just another Trillion dollar bunko scheme to enrich the rich and tax the poor and middle classes?

I know my answers to these and many other questions. Just wondering how others might view it. :mad:

I feel like a kid in school when the teacher asks a softball question. Gotta knock it out of the park. NO-NO-NO-NO-NO and YES-----We're SCREWED 08!:mad:

FedFixNix
7th October 2008, 01:36
I feel like a kid in school when the teacher asks a softball question. Gotta knock it out of the park. NO-NO-NO-NO-NO and YES-----We're SCREWED 08!:mad:

Gold star for the home run!

FedFixNix
7th October 2008, 16:59
Some little known financial facts:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1MY3jMHJZF4

MetalWorx
30th April 2011, 22:09
Good stuff! A link was broke for this vid. money as debt, here is one that is up - http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2550156453790090544#







Nostalgic for the time back when you didnt have to wade through crap for good threads and discussion