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View Full Version : What to do with 10k!?!



Argentum
8th July 2008, 15:58
Today (( 7/8/08 )) I liquidated one of my accounts and after all is said and done, I'll have 10k to plop into PM's.

I thought it would be a cool idea to get some ideas/advice on how best to invest these funds. I thought it might make a good 'class room' discussion for all to see some different ideas - sort of help some of the newer folks as well as getting the old timers brain matter flowing. 10k is not a huge amount, but neither is it a small matter....

Here are some consideration:

1. This is going to be for the long term, for my daughters education. She is 7. This gives a 10 year time frame.

2. Trading should be kept to a min to avoid fees. However, we are here to make gains.

3. All four metals are acceptable for purchase. Plat, Gold, Pall, and Silver. However, I will only buy bullion, no collectable coinage. Here is what I have for current spot price ((feel free to let me know if I need to update))

Gold 920.10
Silver 17.765
Platinum 1950.60
Palladium 445.45

4. There is really no restriction on what form of metal I can buy. 90% silver coin, bars, rounds, 1 oz, 10 oz, 100 oz, etc.

5. Taking physical possession of metal, or take partial is up for discussion so as to better facilitate possible trades in a timely manner. Also, no need to discuss storage options.

6. Funds are available now and must be invested in a timely manner, which is major decision when making a purchase…. Buy now, or maybe hold off and wait for a drop…. Smaller buys more often…. You get my point.

I’m sure I’ve forgotten something, just ask and we’ll get it worked out. Please keep in mind, at the end of the day, I'm going to do what I think is best. If this turns out to be fun for everyone I can keep it updated. In any case I will post up how the 10k was invested... that way you can all tell me "see I told ya so" or "dude, you da man" :p

clr8ter
8th July 2008, 17:03
I would, (and I actually plan to myself), wait to see how the spot shakes out in the next few weeks, hopefully to get a better price, and get a SE Monster box.

nuslvrkwen
8th July 2008, 17:04
YOUR DAUGHTER IS VERY LUCKY!!! Her dad is planning for her college and I'm SURE a PM investment will yield better than that bank run college fund. I'm so NOT into Mutual Funds these days. Your time frame for her going to college and me retiring is about the same. I'm thinking our current mess with funding and commodities will be around for 5 years or so.

I'm sure you're going to buy bullion, but the reason I'd stick with silver rather than buying the other metals is what happens when the prices rise to a level you can't comfortably buy more when it dips? I initially got into gold coins and realized if I wanted to build the investment I'd only be able to afford to buy 3 or so coins a year, when I can buy much more silver now, (and maybe for another 6 months). It's easier to fathom buying ounces of silver at $114 say; compared to an ounce of gold for $1100 or $1400 an ounce.

TTAZZMAN
8th July 2008, 17:50
if i were bent on spending 10k today on pms with long term in mind i would

buy a half bag of 90% silver @ $6300 +/- and 5-1oz gold Krugerands @ 930ea @ $4600 +/-

and have 2-300 left over for something fun like misc silver dollars or something

I would probably purchase it all either locally or at APMEX with these quantities and get it shipped in one lot

hiyosilver
8th July 2008, 21:12
(5) 100 troy ounce Pan American bars, the remainder in 90%.....but I too think we'll see a good buy dip this summer.

Argentum
8th July 2008, 21:59
Ok, so we are all in agreement that 90% silver is on the "buy list". I can buy $100 face within a fraction of the same cost of $1000 face, and can buy $100 face of half-dollar only bags with a small bump in price... so maybe, say 3 lots of $100 face?

I would also like to have a bit of gold, and depending what will give me the top spot, I be looking at four oz. I might have a solid price on Phills, but we will see.

That sort of leaves a bit of room for buying maybe in a week or so... then round it out with a 10 oz bar and top off with ASE's??

balou2
8th July 2008, 22:22
I can't back up my projections, nor do I have prophetic advice, but for 10 year term, diversity is good. I truly believe we're going to see prices fall over the next 6 months. We may hit $20 in Ag soon, but I definitely see prices coming down next year as the economy settles a little (I don't subscribe, fully, to the SHTF scenarios).

Personally I would do this:

- I don't subscribe to the 90% thing. Sorry. I'm sure many on here disagree, but I don't have interest in it based on the factors that go in to it (wear on coins, not knowing what you'll get, etc...)

- I would get at least 2 x 100oz bars. They're a little cheaper than anything else, based on quantity.

- 100 x 1oz rounds. These carry the same value of spot, but can sell with a slight premium depending on what you get.

- Definitely consider some small weight gold. If you can do a total of 2-3 ounces, do it.

- Look at Platinum. Even a small amount.

- If you have any interest in actual investments, look at Uranium. The world will be looking for alternative energy resources, and I believe we'll see Uranium be an increasing trade.

Just my .02, for whatever that's worth. Just don't put all your eggs in one basket. Then again, 500oz. of Ag is not a bad thing.

Leave yourself at least $2k for future purchases.

pkrebaum
8th July 2008, 23:05
I'd invest 5K in ten Oz. Silver PanAm bars, and buy 5 Oz. of Gold in one-quarter ounce Canadian Gold Maple Leafs.

100 Oz. PanAm bars are nice but I had to get a larger safety deposit box because the bars were just a smidge too large (Murphy's Law, LOL) for the smallest size box ..... it only held 4. (theory said the box could hold 1,600 Oz., but then reality took a big bite.....)

Both the 5 and 10 Oz. PanAm bars have a mirror finish, come wrapped in protective plastic sleeves, and are stunningly beautiful.

All the above can be had from NWT mint at one of the lowest delivered costs around. The main caveat is their delivery time.....last time I waited 4 months for a 20K order. And for Gold 5 Oz. is their minimum unless you want to purchase from their small quantity store at considerably more markup.

I'm about 95/5 now in Silver/Gold, now I just purchase Gold occasionally at my local coin shop, and will continue with just Gold until I get a more "balanced" PM portfolio, I hope to be at 75/25 Ag/Au within a year.

hiyosilver
8th July 2008, 23:38
- I don't subscribe to the 90% thing.

Not arguing your choice, but in my own experience I've come out significantly better on cost per troy ounce of silver with 90% than with any other form I've purchased. I only buy small quantities at a time when it's available at coin shops and selective about it. I would be leary of buying large bags based on face value too. But what I do with it is kinda fun and I get to get different opinions from "professionals" who have dealt with PMs for years to further my education.

Gino
9th July 2008, 06:56
Silver has grown from circa $5.00 /ozt in 1998 to around 18.00/ozt in 2008. That's equivalent to about 13.5% annual growth in that time. So, if that rate continues, your $10k invested in Silver will grow to around $35k over the next 10 years.

However, inflation in college fees has run at around 550% across the past 17 years, or about 12% annually, see this article (http://www.moneyandmarkets.com/Issues.aspx?Fuse-Lit-Check-Your-Gold-Holdings-1928). So, 13.5% p.a. growth in your silver investment will only be equivalent to a 1.5% p.a. increase in your investment's ability to pay the tuition fees.

Therefore, if current tuition fees are $23,000 as described in that article above, and the annual inflation rates of tuition fees and Silver are constant into the future, then you will need to add an extra $1,800 p.a. to your silver portfolio to close the gap between your ability to pay the tuition fees.

You can calculate actual figures using an compound interest calculator (http://www.moneychimp.com/calculator/compound_interest_calculator.htm) and plugging in today's actual cost of tuition fees.

Interestingly, 13.5% compound growth in the Silver price will have Silver at around $63/ozt in 10 years. To get over $100/ozt in 10 years, Silver will need to grow at an average compound rate of 19% p.a. and even then your $10k won't make up the gap without additional contributions.

I have bought bars.

Nehpets
9th July 2008, 07:07
Your motivation is to acquire/retain wealth. The dream of what it will be used for is something a seller hooks a buyer on to close a sale. When you control wealth it may be used for whatever purpose you choose. Your focus on her developing her study habits, not hanging around any deadbeat friends, and instilling in her a pursuit of excellence will do more to get her through college than any chump change you want to turn into a bankroll is likely to accomplish.

You have 10 thousand dollars and you need to increase it many times so of necessity you can rule out the expensive metals gold, platinum. etc as they will be doing good to double / triple / quadruple . You are left with Silver which could possibly 10X.

You will need to physically get and hold the silver yourself, if you attempt to trade silver and do not have experience you will lose your ten thousand dollars faster than you could drink it up.

To permanently hold paper silver has vast counterparty risks, and to attempt to play silver with the big dogs is foolish. The first lesson is 10 grand

To attempt to Physically hold a precious asset, long term you will need a solid substantial safe.

Take the remaining money and turn it into one ounce silver eagles and put it into the bolted down/ cemented in/ secure /semi-unmovable safe.

Now begin a habit of purchasing Silver Eagles on a regular basis and putting them in the safe.

Buy a few a week do not concern yourself if silver is up or down, do not ever borrow from them for any purpose, do not ever sell them at any price.

In 10/20/30 years you will have the wisdom with what to do with them

' the owl "

Argentum
9th July 2008, 07:58
Oh, no question Gino, this was my 'ongoing' fund. It just happens to have 10k in it atm. And I thought it might make an interesting post as to options for investment.

Hey, and lets be clear here, ain't no way I'm providing a "full ride" She will have to earn her own way too - in some fashion.

Argentum
9th July 2008, 08:02
Your motivation is to acquire/retain wealth. The dream of what it will be used for is something a seller hooks a buyer on to close a sale. When you control wealth it may be used for whatever purpose you choose. Your focus on her developing her study habits, not hanging around any deadbeat friends, and instilling in her a pursuit of excellence will do more to get her through college than any chump change you want to turn into a bankroll is likely to accomplish.


EXACTLY and with holding the metal, she can SEE that my actions back my words. This is something I feel is important for children. Most have little concept of the markets.

hiyosilver
9th July 2008, 12:36
Also have her set aside a portion of her allowance or proceeds from her "lemonade stand", and take her to the coin shop with you to buy herself some 90%, a Englehard prospector, or a Silver Eagle. Along with all the skills, thrills, and good habits she learns in this, teach her also to be discreet and explain why.

7nomads
9th July 2008, 12:40
Ten years ago we had 5k come in for our kids. Our extended family knew about it so we were under the microscope. So we did 1/3 in gold, 1/3 in silver, and 1/3 in I-bonds (3% over CPI).

Results down the road,

Gold 200% increase
Silver 200 % increase
I-bonds 61% increase
Live and learn

Given the same experience today, I would buy 1/3 today or before the 15th.

Remember mim. wage is going up this month, and I hear that one major grocery store is going up on prices soon.

Argentum
9th July 2008, 16:50
Today at @16:30 CST I made the following buys:

1 oz Krugerrand. Cost = $942.33 ((Spot $927.50))

.50 oz American Platinum Eagle. Cost = $1001.92 ((Spot $1950.60))

100 oz CMX approved Silver Bullion Bar. Cost = $1919.00 ((Spot $18.105))

US90% Silver Coin, $100 face, Halves pre 1965 ((71.50oz)). Cost = $1287.75 ((Spot $18.11))

50 ASE. Cost $994.85 ((Spot $18.11))


Total investment: $6145.85

Shipping, when I finish buying will be @$25

SilverHawk
14th July 2008, 00:05
Buy a used Corvette......

......Ah this is the Corvette Club Forum? . . . isn't it?

SilverHawk
14th July 2008, 00:06
www.tulving.com

no brainer

Argentum
15th July 2008, 08:05
On July 12th I got a hell of deal on China Unicorn rounds, .999 silver rounds for $14.95 - bought 100 of them.

balou2
15th July 2008, 20:56
On July 12th I got a hell of deal on China Unicorn rounds, .999 silver rounds for $14.95 - bought 100 of them.

Uh...help a brother out. How the hell did you do that? Online source?

Argentum
15th July 2008, 21:54
Well, It was on Bullion Direct. It was up for like an hour or some such. A few of us got in on the buy and then it went off the exchange. There is a thread over there. So far it's all good and really don't know if it was a computer error or what. I did e-mail them to let them know that the listing was "odd" and was not sure if it was .999 fine. But every purchase I've ever done with them has been cool, so I figured what the hell, bought 100 of them. And they are all One oz .999 rounds China mint Unicorns. I'm going to take delivery of them as soon as the wire clears this week as I'm interested is seeing them. I've done a few searches on the web and it would seem they have a healthy numis quality. But then I've also heard that there have been a few fakes on ebay. But BD backs the metal so what the heck, for $14.95 it was worth a shot.

Argentum
15th July 2008, 22:03
Oh, and FWIW, I'll ALWAYS pass on a good deal if I hear of one.... the more we all buy the better for us all. Not like I'm going to corner the silver market single handed.

I buy from three of the often listed places that we all know about, no super secret hook ups here.

I did tell my wife that if the price does stick and I don't get one of them letters saying that there was a glitch that I would donate 10% to the summer bible school program. LOL, Jason is starting to really get to me with his news letters!