PDA

View Full Version : Shtf?



The Big Red 1
8th June 2008, 09:28
Anyone have guesses in percentages as to the chance of SHTF? I'm considering hoarding 90% coin for this occcurrence. Good idea, yes?

TBR1

Phaeton
8th June 2008, 12:15
Anyone have guesses in percentages as to the chance of SHTF? I'm considering hoarding 90% coin for this occcurrence. Good idea, yes?

TBR1

S will HTF in one way or another. Whether it be the true price of silver/oz that is finally present or it be the collapse of our wonderful fiat currency.

I was never too hooked on owning 90%, but after reading many posts from the veterans here (who firmly support owning 90%), that have been collecting silver for years, I will be picking up at least 300 oz of it over the next couple of months. I'm a fan of owning a variety of different kinds (Small bars, Eagles, Maples etc..) and a fan of getting the best price!

Also, if you look back at the 80's, when silver was at $50, 90% was huge! It usually brought more of a premium. You probably won't do wrong getting 90%, but don't forget to add in just a bit of .999

.... Just my thoughts

goldminer
9th June 2008, 20:00
Define "SHTF". There many, many manners both natural and man-made in which TScouldHTF....and each of them have degrees.

One thing you can be sure of is that throughout the world the culture, socioeconomic, and political aspects are evolving...changing. It has been going on since the beginning of human kind and it will continue. Things are always changing. There has never been a nation or empire in the annals of human history that didn't evolve upward and then in varying degrees in different ways, and then decline.

It's happing to the U.S. today....evolved upward in wealth, power, and influence, and now is delcining. On average democracies have lasted only 200 years. The U.S. is over that now and sprialing in decline in wealth, influcence, and power (military might yes but who respects either the might of the U.S., it's country, people, democratic principles, constitution, system of government with all it's corruption (no politition is looking out for anybody buy him or her self), or anything else.

Will the SHTF? Depeneds on how you define it...one thing is for sure the U.S. has moved tremendously towards the left in the last 40-plus years and continues that movement today. Where will it go? Who knows...but one thing a person can bet on is that the left doesn't work for anybody except the folks who collect and redistribute the monies hard-working people earn.

SO get set for that because it's gonna happen. Is this TSHTF? I don't know...depends on perspective. I don't think there is a "right". "wrong", "good" or "bad" about change (evolving). Rather, change is just what's real and a person better accept it and focus on work to position themself so they and their's are minimually impacted....because it's happening and it's gonna continue happening. What has been and is going on can not be turned around in any of our lifetimes. It's just going to excellerate and go wherever it is going to go. Bet on it.

TechGnosis
10th June 2008, 00:28
...one thing is for sure the U.S. has moved tremendously towards the left in the last 40-plus years and continues that movement today. Where will it go? Who knows...but one thing a person can bet on is that the left doesn't work for anybody except the folks who collect and redistribute the monies hard-working people earn.

At the risk of sounding naive, I'd like to ask: what is "the left"? The only objective sense of the term would imply you're saying the U.S. is moving into the Pacific, but I expect you're using the term metaphorically to refer to some sort of political polarity, such as Communism/Capitalism. Can you clarify?

Drumblebum
10th June 2008, 08:34
At the risk of sounding naive, I'd like to ask: what is "the left"? The only objective sense of the term would imply you're saying the U.S. is moving into the Pacific, but I expect you're using the term metaphorically to refer to some sort of political polarity, such as Communism/Capitalism. Can you clarify?

This may not be the best example - there are other on the net if one searches for "political spectrum"...

TechGnosis
10th June 2008, 10:23
I meant could you clarify what you mean by saying America has moved to the left. I realise there are many ideas of what that spectrum is.

Drumblebum
10th June 2008, 11:09
I meant could you clarify what you mean by saying America has moved to the left. I realise there are many ideas of what that spectrum is.

Ah. I guess I assumed too little. Or too much as the case may be. Not attempting to insult anyone's intelligence...:D

goldminer
10th June 2008, 14:52
"......what is the left."

Sorry, should have been more clear....

The "left" (or "left wing") is a political term used in the U.S. to report interests (people) who desire big government running everything due to the fact that "the people" certainly can't do it for themselves, because they are not as smart, are not as well informed (have received inferior education), and do not understand how a country and the world "should" be run...like we superior people do.

More precisely, the "left" is a political and social view that runs the gammet from "liberal" through "Socialist", Communist", "Marxist", and "Fascist" philosophies. These systems basically desire to control the people and everything else not only in the nation but also in the world. They "The State giveth, and the State taketh away; blessed be the State....course I mean the state with ME and folks like me running things.

Big government, bigger government programs, higher taxes to pay for the programs, dictate everything to the people....collect ALL of the money from hard working people and redistribute it as we (the elite who run the state) best know how to do...all (of course) for the good of the people.

Never mind that this type of government with it's built in political and social system, has never worked anytime in history. Course I guess you could say that the folks in Cuba (for instance) have it real good because the dictatorial government ("State") allows them to have a whole 5 gallons of gasoline every month.

In the U.S. because the terms "Socialist", "Communist", and "Marxist" historically have not been socially or politically acceptable, a new term has been coined and has been widely used. It's "Progressive"...has the same overall ditctatorial desires as other "left-wing" sociopolitical perspectives yet...how could ANYONE oppose a person being progressive in the most progressive nation in the world? What a scam - and the sheeple seemingly don't even know it.

The Big Red 1
16th June 2008, 18:32
I suppose I consider SHTF to be very high inflation. Maybe then people would start using other forms of money. 90%......?? Also any bank failure situation, or something similar. I personally don't think we will slide down into total anarchy, at laest I hope not.

TBR1

Drumblebum
17th June 2008, 10:38
I personally don't think we will slide down into total anarchy, at laest I hope not.

TBR1

Speak for yourself. ;)

The word "anarchy" too often is incorrectly equated with total chaos. The government ("archy") has already proven that what they bring to the table isn't exactly ideal. The world would be a lot better off with a situation closer to true anarchy than the political establishment we are currently living under.

Government is force. No more, no less. Force is antithetical to freedom.

pkrebaum
17th June 2008, 12:47
Before slandering the left, go here and see where you really are on the political spectrum:

http://www.politicalcompass.org/

Contrary to our fascist Right's disinformation campaign, lefties don't want the government to run everything. They want responsible and accountable government, not big government. Most importantly we don't want government telling us how to live our personal lives.

The right, not the left, has been responsible for the decline of the middle class as they have cut income tax rates and non-wage forms of taxation for the ultra-rich, and balanced the budget on the backs of the middle class by cutting the social programs which benefitted the middle and lower classes.

All of the more socialist countries in Europe have a higher standard of living than the U.S.A., their people are happier, healthier, more educated, compete better in the job markets, and live an average of 10 years longer than we do.

And don't say "well why not go live there then", because if T.S. really H.T.F., .... that's where me and my Silver will be.

Take the test at politicalcompass. You'll be surprised at how lefty you really are.

JesterJay
17th June 2008, 14:49
Holy tumbling over sideways!
That site is one of the most leftist "tests" I have ever seen. The first question is a DEAD give away.
To your points:
Tax cuts benefit everyone, especially those who pay the MAJORITY of the taxes in the first place. The rich that you villify pay the Bulk of the cost of EVERYTHING.
Social Programs for the middle and lower class MY ASS. Just get the hell out of my pocket and protect the country.
The left (especially) wants to control everything. HOW YOU DO EVERYTHING. Just say "How high?".
Your info on Europe vs. USA happiness is far from FACT. And making broad general statements on "happier" and "compete better" are hardly substantiated.
Not right or left, just Right,
JesterJay




Before slandering the left, go here and see where you really are on the political spectrum:

http://www.politicalcompass.org/

Contrary to our fascist Right's disinformation campaign, lefties don't want the government to run everything. They want responsible and accountable government, not big government. Most importantly we don't want government telling us how to live our personal lives.

The right, not the left, has been responsible for the decline of the middle class as they have cut income tax rates and non-wage forms of taxation for the ultra-rich, and balanced the budget on the backs of the middle class by cutting the social programs which benefitted the middle and lower classes.

All of the more socialist countries in Europe have a higher standard of living than the U.S.A., their people are happier, healthier, more educated, compete better in the job markets, and live an average of 10 years longer than we do.

And don't say "well why not go live there then", because if T.S. really H.T.F., .... that's where me and my Silver will be.

Take the test at politicalcompass. You'll be surprised at how lefty you really are.

balou2
17th June 2008, 17:58
It is pretty blatantly left, but it put me in almost the dead center (which is where I fall in almost any poll). Fiscal conservative, Social liberal.

pkrebaum
17th June 2008, 22:59
Jay,

The test is neither left nor right, it's just a test. Your score determines whether you are are left or right.

The statements made in regards to Europe are factual.

An excellent primer for tax-reactionaries is "10 Excellent Reasons Not To Hate Taxes" (from Amazon.com).... How far do you live from where you work ? At the going rate of $1,000,000 per mile could you afford to build a road between your house and your job? A government which provides ONLY for defense won't do that. In fact, read the premble to our constitution..... defense is not the only thing mentioned.

"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common Defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.''

"The commitment to promote the general welfare of all persons, as opposed to protecting the interests of a narrow section or class of the population, encapsulates what is most unique about the United States of America--that it is the only modern nation-state republic founded on this principle." -Edward Spannaus

Societies, nations,...they rise and sink as a whole. Lefties believe in a stong society, which is the general welfare. "Social Programs" such as education, they are investments in ourselves and our future. Lastly, don't take too much pity on the ultra-rich ... by and large they got there via your labor, taking all they could for themselves and leaving you with the scraps. They should pay a much higher percentage of their incomes, and for the work we perform for them every day we deserve to have that come back to us in the form of good schools, good infrastructure, personal liberty, equal justice, and an effective safety net for all those who want to work (which, contrary to common belief, is just about everybody).

It was Warren Buffet who said that it was IMMORAL that his secretary paid a higher percentage of her earnings to the government than he did.

pkrebaum
18th June 2008, 01:17
the U.S. lags Europe in life expectancy by 3 - 5 1/2 years, not 10. Sorry, I should have checked that popular source for accuracy. The U.S. is 45th in worldwide life expectancy. References for my other assertions follow:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_Human_Development_Index

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_life_expectancy

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/index.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misery_index_%28economics%29

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satisfaction_with_Life_Index

balou2
18th June 2008, 01:44
the U.S. lags Europe in life expectancy by 3 - 5 1/2 years, not 10. Sorry, I should have checked that popular source for accuracy. The U.S. is 45th in worldwide life expectancy. References for my other assertions follow:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_Human_Development_Index

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_life_expectancy

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/index.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misery_index_%28economics%29

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satisfaction_with_Life_Index

Sorry...I had to chuckle...according to the first link it says the US is a "functioning democracy" ;)